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Buzzfox

Wing Mirror to Wing Mirror Clash - Advice Please?

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My good lady has had an altercation with another driver on the way home tonight, what should the best course of action be?

Here's what happened: She was driving on a narrow back road when an oncoming car, apparently driving very quickly, (2009 Audi A4 TDi) clipped mirrors. She didn't stop as there wasn't anywhere particularly safe to do so and as her mirror glass hadn't even broken she didn't think it was necessary. A few miles down the road while stopped at the front of the queue at a set of lights the Audi shot down the line of traffic, screeched to a halt in front of her car and 2 fellas jumped out and started shouting at her that she'd smashed his mirror and what was she going to do about it. 

She was absolutely terrified, is still in shock and tears now, and in her panic just asked how fast he was going which he would not answer. Anyway they swapped phone numbers and he said he would be in touch. He has apparently rung this evening before I got home but she was too frightened to answer it and he hasn't left a message yet.

From what she's said there can be no way to apportion blame so the insurance company will simply go 50/50 and everyone will loose out except the insurance company - is that fair to say??

My thoughts are to get an estimate from a local garage to replace an Audi A4 mirror, then call this fella and at the best tell him to get a quote and if it's close to the one I've got, offer to pay half. If he gets a**ey about it I'll suggest we each go through insurance and let them sort it out. 

I've also suggested my good lady calls her insurance company and tell them about it and that we don't intend to claim in the morning just as a butt cover in case he's already called his. Is that a sensible thing to do or should we just leave it and see how he wants to proceed?

It really grieves me to pay half for this kind of thing but my good lady is in bits and worried sick about what will happen so I just want to get the situation sorted ASAP but I'm not willing to get ripped off to any great level!!

 

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Dashcam in either car, witnesses? (His mate does not count as not independent.)

If not, tell him to take a running jump as no way of apportioning blame. 

 

 

Edited by Scubaregs

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1 minute ago, Scubaregs said:

Dashcam in either car, witnesses? (His mate does not count as not independent.)

If not, tell him to take a running jump as no way of apportioning blame. 

 

 

No, no dashcams or witnesses. I am very tempted to tell him where to get off but he sounded like a nasty piece of work so I'm willing to be the bigger man and offer 50/50 as long as it's reasonable even if it's just to let my better half sleep soundly.

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50/50 means you both do nothing. I assume you would pay for his mirror if he quotes a reasonable price, for your wife's peace of mind?

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1 hour ago, Scubaregs said:

50/50 means you both do nothing. I assume you would pay for his mirror if he quotes a reasonable price, for your wife's peace of mind?

I'm willing to give him half towards it, as you say purely for her peace of mind and as long as he doesn't take the p**s with a ridiculous quote.

Our mirror on the Volvo isn't really worth bothering with, the indicator lens part built into it is cracked and that's about it, all motors work fine and the glass is all intact.

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Knock for knock. Just ignore him.

He sounds like a right 🔔 end driving in that aggressive manner to chase her down. Loads like him on the roads, unfortunately.

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7 hours ago, Buzzfox said:

A few miles down the road while stopped at the front of the queue at a set of lights the Audi shot down the line of traffic, screeched to a halt in front of her car and 2 fellas jumped out and started shouting at her that she'd smashed his mirror and what was she going to do about it. 

She was absolutely terrified, is still in shock and tears now, and in her panic just asked how fast he was going which he would not answer. Anyway they swapped phone numbers and he said he would be in touch. He has apparently rung this evening before I got home but she was too frightened to answer it and he hasn't left a message yet.

As much as it grieves me to write this - whatever's right isn't necessarily what's expedient for you.  

If these guys are as aggressive as it sounds then it may just be worth paying for the mirror - in this situation I would not want someone in my family being exposed to the possibility of further intimidating behaviour especially as they now have a mobile number.  

By all means have a go at reasoning with the guy - he may have calmed down a bit this morning - and if you can reach a sensible solution great.  On the other hand if he won't then just revert to the insurers and if he gets too punchy then it might be worth a quick visit to your local police station - in my experience they take a pretty dim view on this sort of threatening behaviour.  A quick call from them might just calm things down enough to sort it out.

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10 hours ago, Buzzfox said:

No, no dashcams or witnesses. I am very tempted to tell him where to get off but he sounded like a nasty piece of work so I'm willing to be the bigger man and offer 50/50 as long as it's reasonable even if it's just to let my better half sleep 

This👍

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Get police involved, 2 guys chasing down a woman and then intimidation, can't have that, how many other times has he done this sort of thing???

Edited by headless

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1 minute ago, headless said:

Get police involved, 2 guys chasing down a woman and then intimidation, can't have that, how many other times have he done this sort of thing???

This. Whatever you do on the financial side (and if knock for knock then he should pay for 50% of your repair rather than you just paying 50%) shouty aggressive behaviour is so inappropriate to use against a woman on her own. As your wife is badly shaken and they have her  mobile phone number I'd want the matter logged with the police in case more threatening behaviour follows.

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The other side - two guys happily driving along, Volvo comes round the corner, doesn't leave room, smashes their expensive heated mirror and just drives off, no attempt to stop.  Both infuriated, get buzzed up by the chase of this arrogant miscreant, and vent with a volley of insults once they arrive.

I like the comment about maybe they have calmed down now, and I also suggest 50/50 of a sort (remembering that some mirrors can cost a fortune these days) and if he doesn't play ball then pointing out that two guys threatening a lone woman might give him a lot more costs than half a mirror - his choice. Also point out that next time they phone her if they are anything other than polite it will be considered a continuation of the threatening.

did she get any ID like a number plate?

Edited by Menoporsche

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Also, again devils advocate, was she legally obliged to stop?

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2 hours ago, Menoporsche said:

The other side - two guys happily driving along, Volvo comes round the corner, doesn't leave room, smashes their expensive heated mirror and just drives off, no attempt to stop.  Both infuriated, get buzzed up by the chase of this arrogant miscreant, and vent with a volley of insults once they arrive.

I like the comment about maybe they have calmed down now, and I also suggest 50/50 of a sort (remembering that some mirrors can cost a fortune these days) and if he doesn't play ball then pointing out that two guys threatening a lone woman might give him a lot more costs than half a mirror - his choice. Also point out that next time they phone her if they are anything other than polite it will be considered a continuation of the threatening.

did she get any ID like a number plate?

I take you're point, I really do, which is why I don't want to start reporting all this to the police. I think their behaviour was disgraceful, there are ways to deal with this kind of thing and bully boy scare mongering isn't it! I don't know who was at fault, I wasn't there, and maybe she should have stopped so I'm happy to pay half their cost as long as it's not some trumped up ludicrous cost. I'm struggling to forgive how terrified they made her feel but I will not be unreasonable if he's not now he's had time to calm down. 

What I do know is that a while ago a fella caused thousands of pounds worth of damage to my car and didn't behave like that, there is no excuse for it.

She did get his reg, phone number and first name but that was it as she was so stressed. 

She's just explained a bit more that I misunderstood. Apparently she wasn't stationary at lights, she'd just driven round the roadworks and he shot round them and her, pulled in front and stopped causing her to do an emergency stop to avoid t-boning him - unbelievable!

 

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I think Meno has this summed up well.

Obviously they would be angry at the time as in their view had their mirror smashed and it wasn't their fault, and the person failed to stop - so they spin around and hunt down the person who drove off. Of course they didn't consider that that they could be dealing with someone who was frightened - they considered it was someone trying to get away with it.

The damage is minor and involving the insurance company will mean both drivers have their premiums raised - and for three years - which isn't worth it, clearly the other driver considers your good lady to be at fault and probably because she didn't stop after the accident. I know these mirrors are expensive but im pretty sure the fellow will have calmed down now and ready to discuss though it wouldn't have helped not answering his call when he rang - he will view it as another attempt to evade responsibility - so you should call him - discuss and come to an agreement regarding fixing his car - if he wont accept 50% contribution - and why should he if he actually wasn't at fault (in his view) so You either reach an agreement at 50% - or you pay the entire bill - or - you go through the insurrance.

I had a driver do the same thing to my car a few years ago - didn't stop - my mirror was smashed - the glass and the body - I was livid - I wished I had chased after them instead of picking up the pieces of the mirror - I assumed they had stopped down the road - but no - drove off - I was quite mad about it for days

Edited by Glyn

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50/50 move on, if he doesnt like it then remind them of the frightening situation given by them and their actions against a lone woman and suggest Police are involved if he isnt happy...I would not report to insurance company unless intend to claim

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50/50, just change her mobile number and move on, or answer it yourself and tell them to sod off, if not then advise them that you will be reporting their behaviour to the police.

I take it no address was given?

No excuse for their threatening behaviour.

Leave the insurance company out of it.

Edited by RBD914 v2

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As they obviously have not tried to contact you again, it looks like they have calmed down and decided to let it drop.

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11 minutes ago, Scubaregs said:

As they obviously have not tried to contact you again, it looks like they have calmed down and decided to let it drop.

Sadly not! She received a text message from him this morning simply saying did she get his message which we didn't so I'm not sure what his stance is right now but he's obviously going to pursue it. I'll have to ring him over the weekend and sort it out one way or another. She did give him our home address but didn't take his unfortunately.

I've had a rough estimate from an Audi dealership which is a ridiculous price but it's obviously worse case. If he won't negotiate and I end up giving him the whole lot then so be it, life's too short to dick about with these kind of people and the Mrs can start sleeping again. In the words of Percy from Black Adder - "A piffling 600, pay the man Edmond and damn his impudence"

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Wife giving out the home address does change things.

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Putting all of the peripheral concerns to one side for a moment, look at the circumstances of the accident.

- Narrow road, limited space for two cars to pass.

- Mirror to mirror clash whilst passing. 

- Neither car was presumably over any central white line (because there wasn't one)

- No independent witnesses

Given all of the facts, any insurance company would record it as knock-for-knock.  Personally, I would explain that to the chap, state their is similar damage to your car and suggest that you both accept responsibility for your own repairs.  Explain that the alternative is to take it to the insurers who will do exactly the same but additionally raise both your premiums AND given the excess you'll still need to pay for the majority of the repair anyway.

Any right-minded person will see that there is no point persuing it in reality.  

A lot of your decision making seems to be based on their behaviour in the heat of the moment.  I would suggest you try and put that to one side and deal with the problem directly.  If, after some days to reflect, they are still choosing to be unreasonable then you know the type of person you're dealing with.  Until then, don't assume they are actually that unreasonable.

I had a similar knock-for-knock situation recently, well actually someone hit my car it was entirely their fault but the damage was so slight I just didn't consider it worthwhile to chase them for it, paid it myself and put it down to running costs.

 

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Why have you assumed its her fault and not theirs? 

If she hadn't given the home address I would ignore it and tell em to F off. As the family home is potentially at risk and judging by their behaviour, I can only, sadly, imagine they would go as far as damaging property - I'd try getting them to either sort it out themselves, pay half of it - or go through insurance so they don't think they've won.

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If you gave out home address in good faith due to a car accident, and ended up getting threatened, I'd like to think that the police would have something to say. Maybe you don't know where they live but they should be able to find out if necessary.  Unless of course it's a caravan of sorts (like my brother's dodgy builder - left a nasty taste paying him, but the alternative was months of sleepless nights - not worth it).

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As I said, they're having the home address changes everything.

Perhaps call and offer to pay half of the cost of his mirror, whilst admitting no liability, then pay through paypal?

If they aren't willing to do that, either pay in full or tell them it is your final offer and that you consider the matter closed if they don't want to accept it.

Might be worth mentioning that one of the chaps on here has a particular skill set that can cause some very serious injuries to vulnerable body areas and that if need be, you will get him involved.

(ON NO ACCOUNT TELL THEM said member is @JohnK and that all the injuries were self inflicted.)

 

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I would call Police 101 and log the 'incident'........ tell them what happened so it's on record; including the intimidation...... this way you cannot be later charged with "leaving the scene of an RTC" which can carry points and a hefty fine.

I would NOT call your insurance. As you say no one will claim (As clearly 50 50) and they might (will) increase your premiums next year / future years.

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