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Is this an RMS leak?


MarkyRR
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Afternoon folks,

I’ve not long had (around 3-4 weeks or so) my late 2003 ‘S’, which went through a PPI with pretty much flying colours.  I’ve noticed oil on my drive and have today managed to reach underneath to look with a torch/take some photos.  I’m afraid it would seem to be the RMS unless I’m mistaken?  Would you guys mind looking at the photos to give me your thoughts please? I appreciate if it is the RMS it’s not the end of the world until clutch change time (I’m on 78k now), but just wanted confirmation.

Thank you!

http://www.simpleimageresizer.com/_uploads/photos/af265026/7D829B8E-64D5-4EFE-9158-1F6CEA843B48_25.jpeg

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That is either your RMS or your IMSB flange leaking.

No one in world will be able to tell you which one it is without removing the box.

What I would suggest though, is that you get that looked at urgently as it is wet oil and as you mention it has leaked on your drive. 

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11 minutes ago, TROOPER88 said:

That is either your RMS or your IMSB flange leaking.

No one in world will be able to tell you which one it is without removing the box.

What I would suggest though, is that you get that looked at urgently as it is wet oil and as you mention it has leaked on your drive. 

Thanks very much.  An oil change 3/4 weeks ago showed completely clean oil (ie. no metal particles etc) so assumed it would mean the RMS rather than IMS bearing/flange? The leak has only manifested itself around a week ago, so approx 2’3 weeks after the change.  
 

Bit of bad luck/££ upcoming I feel….bit gutted with the report of the car I had before buying it 🙈

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It needn't be too costly if you just have the RMS changed but if your clutch is original, best to change at the same time.

Who did the inspection?

I have had owned 100 986's and a few 987's, all but a few have had a minor RMS leak. It is a coagulation of 20 plus years of oil and is never wet oil but more of a dirty patch.

 

As long as it is just a small patch, it is perfectly normal and Porsche call it 'sweat'. 

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7 minutes ago, TROOPER88 said:

It needn't be too costly if you just have the RMS changed but if your clutch is original, best to change at the same time.

Who did the inspection?

I have had owned 100 986's and a few 987's, all but a few have had a minor RMS leak. It is a coagulation of 20 plus years of oil and is never wet oil but more of a dirty patch.

 

As long as it is just a small patch, it is perfectly normal and Porsche call it 'sweat'. 

It was a guy called Nick Giles from 986 owners group on Facebook who was very in depth, so why I’m thinking it’s bad luck.  The car had been a bit of a garage queen for the last few years, so now I’ve started using it regularly I think it’s had a bit of a shock.  I just spoke to Wrightune who are my local independent who say 12 hours to remove/refit RMS. Also confirmed what I already knew about it being a good idea to do the clutch at same time.  It was also mentioned about the probability of needing new exhaust clamps etc if mine are too far gone.

Sadly as you can see in the photos, it’s more than just a dirty patch, especially leaving oil patches on the drive and showing as wet on the car.

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Just googling to get an idea of costs out there for this whilst I wait for Wrightune to email over a list & see a couple of Indy’s (pmrsche in Redditch & revolution porsche near Leeds) who do the work for £625 & £549 + vat respectively.  It’s noted that the RMS is approx £50 to supply/fit if required and exhaust clamps etc may be needed are supplied/fitted at counter prices.  These seem quite a cost saving over prices discussed this morning (approx £1000 labour plus main seal/clutch kit/clamps etc).

Any thoughts either way?

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4 hours ago, MarkyRR said:

It was a guy called Nick Giles from 986 owners group on Facebook who was very in depth, so why I’m thinking it’s bad luck.  The car had been a bit of a garage queen for the last few years, so now I’ve started using it regularly I think it’s had a bit of a shock.  I just spoke to Wrightune who are my local independent who say 12 hours to remove/refit RMS. Also confirmed what I already knew about it being a good idea to do the clutch at same time.  It was also mentioned about the probability of needing new exhaust clamps etc if mine are too far gone.

Sadly as you can see in the photos, it’s more than just a dirty patch, especially leaving oil patches on the drive and showing as wet on the car.

Do you have the report from Nick Giles? What does it say about the RMS/IMSB leak? Any pictures in the report of it?

 

With regard exhaust fittings, yes, most likely you will require 2 x muffler to cat sleeves and 2 x muffler to cat support brackets. I usually have to cut the existing fittings as they corrode badly.

Personally, I would not drive your car, wait for your indy to fit you in and have it recovered there.

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If it is the RMS, it may stop dripping after driving your car. I remember I bought mine around 5-6 years ago, and it wasn't driven much, had a service at revolution and it dropped a few blobs in my garage, I put some cardboard underneath it to monitor it. A few weeks later, as it was daily driven, noticed there was no new oil drops on the cardboard so threw it away... 6 years later... No issues to report!

So maybe you just need to drive it and "it will sort itself out"?

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15 hours ago, TROOPER88 said:

Do you have the report from Nick Giles? What does it say about the RMS/IMSB leak? Any pictures in the report of it?

 

With regard exhaust fittings, yes, most likely you will require 2 x muffler to cat sleeves and 2 x muffler to cat support brackets. I usually have to cut the existing fittings as they corrode badly.

Personally, I would not drive your car, wait for your indy to fit you in and have it recovered there.

Thanks for your input. It’s appreciated.  I’ve contacted Nick to get him to send (re-send?) the report, but he spoke to me at length on the phone the same day as he inspected it and no mention was made of any leaks.  The car only covered a few hundred miles over the last couple of years….I’ve put 1000 on it in the last 3/4 weeks, so it’s starting to be used now.  My concern is the amount of oil being dropped on the drive, so it’s certainly going to be looked at.  I bought it with the intention of using it as my daily, so want it sorted.

I had the costs details through from my local Indy, which looked at £104 for exhaust clamps, and if I don’t need a flywheel, it’ll be in the region of £1650 including vat (clutch, RMS, IMS cover plate seal, tensioner rings). An additional £400 + vat for a flywheel.  I think I’m struggling with the large costs difference between this and the £559 + vat at revolution for the clutch, with £50 for RMS.  Even with adding in the same costs for the additional items above (not flywheel), they would be just short of £900 including vat. In fact, their price for clutch AND IMS bearing isn’t a great deal more than just the clutch at my local.  

I’ve not a great deal of experience with Indy’s, so I’m really unsure as to what to do.  The obvious thing is the locality & if there’s any issues following the work I guess, but potentially £700 difference isn’t to be ignored.

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10 minutes ago, MarkyRR said:

Thanks for your input. It’s appreciated.  I’ve contacted Nick to get him to send (re-send?) the report, but he spoke to me at length on the phone the same day as he inspected it and no mention was made of any leaks.  The car only covered a few hundred miles over the last couple of years….I’ve put 1000 on it in the last 3/4 weeks, so it’s starting to be used now.  My concern is the amount of oil being dropped on the drive, so it’s certainly going to be looked at.  I bought it with the intention of using it as my daily, so want it sorted.

I had the costs details through from my local Indy, which looked at £104 for exhaust clamps, and if I don’t need a flywheel, it’ll be in the region of £1650 including vat (clutch, RMS, IMS cover plate seal, tensioner rings). An additional £400 + vat for a flywheel.  I think I’m struggling with the large costs difference between this and the £559 + vat at revolution for the clutch, with £50 for RMS.  Even with adding in the same costs for the additional items above (not flywheel), they would be just short of £900 including vat. In fact, their price for clutch AND IMS bearing isn’t a great deal more than just the clutch at my local.  

I’ve not a great deal of experience with Indy’s, so I’m really unsure as to what to do.  The obvious thing is the locality & if there’s any issues following the work I guess, but potentially £700 difference isn’t to be ignored.

Post up a pick from Nicks report (chase him for it) and I’ll have a look.

 

Don't drive the car.

 

A RMS is usually very slow. They only tend to leak a lot if they have just been fitted and fitted at the incorrect depth.

My gut feeling is that it’s your IMS flange but as per my original post, no one will know until the box is removed.

 

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8 minutes ago, Scubaregs said:

Did you get a written report at the time of inspection, or have you never had one?

I didn't want to be the first to ask 🤣

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I’ve messaged Nick for the report.  He appears to be very well respected, so don’t have too many concerns regarding his inspection, but would be nice to have the full report to be honest.

The car doesn’t need to be used for a while now, so will hold off using it until I get it sorted…..just a case of where to go with it.

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59 minutes ago, MarkyRR said:

I’ve messaged Nick for the report.  He appears to be very well respected, so don’t have too many concerns regarding his inspection, but would be nice to have the full report to be honest.

The car doesn’t need to be used for a while now, so will hold off using it until I get it sorted…..just a case of where to go with it.

Specialist Cars of Malton were once a well respected Porsche and expensive cars sales specialist but turned out to be anything but. I'm not saying Nick Giles is the same but you're not the first to come on here and write that you paid for something and didn't get all that you paid for. 

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Considering the short time you've had the car and the fact you, like many others, never got the report you paid for as part of the inspection, I'd be asking for a refund of the inspection cost to put towards the bill. Yes the leak may well have manifested itself after the inspection, but you have no written report to see exactly what was noted at time of inspection.

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This is interesting.  I messaged Nick yesterday but not yet received a reply.  I’ve been driving the car up to this morning, yesterday morning I put a drip tray underneath after my 20 mile drive home from night shift and it sat all day with no signs of any drips.  I did the same this morning when I got in and so far still no drips. 🤔

Edited by MarkyRR
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