Tyre wear

[Kev62]

Hi all

I have noticed that the outside 20% of my offside rear tyre has worn down much faster the the near side. Also not even wear across the tyre. Has anyone else experienced this or can advise on cause.

 

my guess is pothole damage causing an alignment issue. To my knowledge the car has no accident damage.

 

Any advice gratefully received 

cheers

 

kev

[Nobbie]

How old is the car? what mileage? How long have you had the car? Could be a worn lower arm or misalignment from a knock the previous owner's had.

[daz05]

Both my rears ended up more worn on the outer edges towards the end of their life, P Zeros N0 spec, and my car was checked and was all in spec when checked by the OPC.  It's probably likely that your offside rear has excessive toe in and is scrubbing a bit.

I plan to reduce a toe in at the rear end toward the specified minimum in the adjustment window.

[Kev62]

17 hours ago, Nobbie said:

How old is the car? what mileage? How long have you had the car? Could be a worn lower arm or misalignment from a knock the previous owner's had.

Hi car is 2013 33500 miles no record or evidence of previous damage.

[Greenman]

What tyres do you have on? Some tyres (P zero for example) have a secondary groove near the outside edge, this secondary groove has less depth than the primary grooves (6mm vs 8mm I think) so it often looks like its wearing much faster than reality on the outside, this secondary groove does not need 1.6mm of tread to be legal, in fact it can look completely gone/worn and still be legal.  

In addition there is a tendency for the outside to wear a bit more than the inside but it should only be maybe 1mm difference over the tyre life (I noticed this when I bought my car but it was the same on the other 3 s/h 981s in the dealership at the time). 

 

[Kev62]

Hi many thanks to all for your help. Am going to get it checked and will update once complet 😊

[daz05]

13 hours ago, Greenman said:

What tyres do you have on? Some tyres (P zero for example) have a secondary groove near the outside edge, this secondary groove has less depth than the primary grooves (6mm vs 8mm I think) so it often looks like its wearing much faster than reality on the outside, this secondary groove does not need 1.6mm of tread to be legal, in fact it can look completely gone/worn and still be legal.  

In addition there is a tendency for the outside to wear a bit more than the inside but it should only be maybe 1mm difference over the tyre life (I noticed this when I bought my car but it was the same on the other 3 s/h 981s in the dealership at the time). 

 

Now that explains exactly why mine was like that, mystery solved!  Thanks

[Gorsh]

I'm concerned about my rear tyres - I have recently noticed the rear of the car starting to slide on corners (in dry conditions), I was putting a fair load on them but I think they let go much easier than they should.  Having a look alarmed me as apart from the edge the outside third of both rear tyres is worn smooth, the tyre tread isn't as deep that side on P Zero's but last time I looked at them before my recent trip to Belgium and Germany there was visible tread across the tyres, now 2000 miles later they seem much more worn.  The car is almost 4 years old and has only completed a total of 9400 miles with about 5500 miles of that being driven by me since I bought the car last July.  The fronts have plenty of tread left and are wearing pretty evenly, the car steers straight and up until now I thought it handled well.  One other thing is that PTV is fitted, I'm not sure if it brakes one rear wheel on corners all the time, or just when cornering very hard - it is noticeable that there is no sign of a hint of understeer on my car, it always turns in well so I expect that is with the help of the PTV.  If the PTV is always braking a rear wheel I wonder how much that causes premature tyre wear, as I think 9400 miles from rear tyres is very poor - does anyone agree, or is that reasonable?  I will be getting the alignment checked soon, and then getting new rear tyres fitted!

Photos of each rear tyre

@Kev62, @daz05  How did you get on with your geometry check, and did your tyres look similar to mine?  @JohnSyn, I think you had new tyres recently, what state were yours in and how many miles had they done?

[daz05]

1 hour ago, Gorsh said:

I'm concerned about my rear tyres - I have recently noticed the rear of the car starting to slide on corners (in dry conditions), I was putting a fair load on them but I think they let go much easier than they should.  Having a look alarmed me as apart from the edge the outside third of both rear tyres is worn smooth, the tyre tread isn't as deep that side on P Zero's but last time I looked at them before my recent trip to Belgium and Germany there was visible tread across the tyres, now 2000 miles later they seem much more worn.  The car is almost 4 years old and has only completed a total of 9400 miles with about 5500 miles of that being driven by me since I bought the car last July.  The fronts have plenty of tread left and are wearing pretty evenly, the car steers straight and up until now I thought it handled well.  One other thing is that PTV is fitted, I'm not sure if it brakes one rear wheel on corners all the time, or just when cornering very hard - it is noticeable that there is no sign of a hint of understeer on my car, it always turns in well so I expect that is with the help of the PTV.  If the PTV is always braking a rear wheel I wonder how much that causes premature tyre wear, as I think 9400 miles from rear tyres is very poor - does anyone agree, or is that reasonable?  I will be getting the alignment checked soon, and then getting new rear tyres fitted!

Photos of each rear tyre

@Kev62, @daz05  How did you get on with your geometry check, and did your tyres look similar to mine?  @JohnSyn, I think you had new tyres recently, what state were yours in and how many miles had they done?

Looked the same buddy and car was in alignment. I'd say your tyre was about done anyway.

You can probably reduce toe in and add a little more camber with the adjustment available to stop it reoccurring but seems it's quite normal with the Pzeros.

I'm going to monitor the wear on the michelin ps4s and if it's going the same way I'm be booking it in as I suggested above.

[Greenman]

1 hour ago, Gorsh said:

I'm concerned about my rear tyres - I have recently noticed the rear of the car starting to slide on corners (in dry conditions), I was putting a fair load on them but I think they let go much easier than they should.  Having a look alarmed me as apart from the edge the outside third of both rear tyres is worn smooth, the tyre tread isn't as deep that side on P Zero's but last time I looked at them before my recent trip to Belgium and Germany there was visible tread across the tyres, now 2000 miles later they seem much more worn.  The car is almost 4 years old and has only completed a total of 9400 miles with about 5500 miles of that being driven by me since I bought the car last July.  The fronts have plenty of tread left and are wearing pretty evenly, the car steers straight and up until now I thought it handled well.  One other thing is that PTV is fitted, I'm not sure if it brakes one rear wheel on corners all the time, or just when cornering very hard - it is noticeable that there is no sign of a hint of understeer on my car, it always turns in well so I expect that is with the help of the PTV.  If the PTV is always braking a rear wheel I wonder how much that causes premature tyre wear, as I think 9400 miles from rear tyres is very poor - does anyone agree, or is that reasonable?  I will be getting the alignment checked soon, and then getting new rear tyres fitted!

Photos of each rear tyre

@Kev62, @daz05  How did you get on with your geometry check, and did your tyres look similar to mine?  @JohnSyn, I think you had new tyres recently, what state were yours in and how many miles had they done?

My PZeros looked similar(ish) when I changed them (not quite as gone on the outside but not far off) however that was after 15k miles. 9.5k is quite a high wear rate. Do you ONLY drive yours on ‘spirited’ drives or does it get daily or Morptorway work as well? It is just the secondary groove that’s worn and there’s still,plenty of tread on the shoulder so doesn’t suggest tracking is way out to me.

i know that PTV can have a huge impact on rear brake wear so you might expect a bit of extra tyre wear as well but (layman’s view) as the tyre would be going round the corner anyway I’d be suprised if it’s a huge difference. I.e it might wear more as brake is applied but that gives a better cornering line leading to less wear mid/late corner.

[Gorsh]

Thanks Guys - I'm going to get the geometry checked anyway just to be sure, then for replacements I'm thinking of trying the PS4S N rated Michelins, they seem to be highly regarded, although I had Goodyear Eagles on my previous BGTS and they seemed good tyres too.  Also, the latest P Zeros that are N1 rated are supposed to be a much better tyre, so I will have to make a choice!

[JohnSyn]

Hi Gordon

Before they were replaced my P Zeros had done 11500 miles and were not as badly worn as yours. I've no idea as to how the car was driven before which of course would contribute to tyre wear.

I got the PS4Ss and they feel a much better tyre than the Pirellis. My car feels all round sharper with them.

[Kev62]

On 5/9/2019 at 6:30 PM, Gorsh said:

I'm concerned about my rear tyres - I have recently noticed the rear of the car starting to slide on corners (in dry conditions), I was putting a fair load on them but I think they let go much easier than they should.  Having a look alarmed me as apart from the edge the outside third of both rear tyres is worn smooth, the tyre tread isn't as deep that side on P Zero's but last time I looked at them before my recent trip to Belgium and Germany there was visible tread across the tyres, now 2000 miles later they seem much more worn.  The car is almost 4 years old and has only completed a total of 9400 miles with about 5500 miles of that being driven by me since I bought the car last July.  The fronts have plenty of tread left and are wearing pretty evenly, the car steers straight and up until now I thought it handled well.  One other thing is that PTV is fitted, I'm not sure if it brakes one rear wheel on corners all the time, or just when cornering very hard - it is noticeable that there is no sign of a hint of understeer on my car, it always turns in well so I expect that is with the help of the PTV.  If the PTV is always braking a rear wheel I wonder how much that causes premature tyre wear, as I think 9400 miles from rear tyres is very poor - does anyone agree, or is that reasonable?  I will be getting the alignment checked soon, and then getting new rear tyres fitted!

Photos of each rear tyre

@Kev62, @daz05  How did you get on with your geometry check, and did your tyres look similar to mine?  @JohnSyn, I think you had new tyres recently, what state were yours in and how many miles had they done?

Hi Gorsh

I have recently had my geometry checked and everything checked out to be correct with no abnormal wear detected. I can confirm that you wear is pretty much the same as mine. I guess this is either a characteristic of P zeros or just the 981 geometry. 

[Gorsh]

15 minutes ago, Kev62 said:

Hi Gorsh

I have recently had my geometry checked and everything checked out to be correct with no abnormal wear detected. I can confirm that you wear is pretty much the same as mine. I guess this is either a characteristic of P zeros or just the 981 geometry. 

Thanks Kev - that's good to hear (but not so good we need tyres so often!).  What are/did you replace them with?  I'm seriously thinking of getting Michelins, even though it will mean replacing all 4 tyres (got a warranty on the car) when the fronts would last a while yet.

[Carmine]

V pleased with the Goodyears that came on my BGTS. Still around 5mm with w/even tread wear at 13K miles. No track use, just a good mix from motorways to Alpine passes. Have never been a fan of Pirellis; they either dry rot, wear funny, tramline or go hard before time.

[Gorsh]

24 minutes ago, Carmine said:

V pleased with the Goodyears that came on my BGTS. Still around 5mm with w/even tread wear at 13K miles. No track use, just a good mix from motorways to Alpine passes. Have never been a fan of Pirellis; they either dry rot, wear funny, tramline or go hard before time.

My first BGTS had the Eagle F1 tyres, and they did seem very good (but I only did about 7k miles before selling) - which is making me slightly undecided what to get next.  However, it seems the MPS4S N0 tyres are very highly praised lately, both on here and PCGB forum, so I'm leaning (quite heavily) towards them.

[GTSMarky]

20 hours ago, Gorsh said:

My first BGTS had the Eagle F1 tyres, and they did seem very good (but I only did about 7k miles before selling) - which is making me slightly undecided what to get next.  However, it seems the MPS4S N0 tyres are very highly praised lately, both on here and PCGB forum, so I'm leaning (quite heavily) towards them.

You may struggle to find 20" compatible sizes for the GTS

[Gorsh]

4 hours ago, GTSMarky said:

You may struggle to find 20" compatible sizes for the GTS

The Pirelli ones (both N0 and the newer N1) are readily available as are the Goodyear Eagles.  The Michelin Pilot Sport 4S N0 are available (235/35 ZR20 and 265/35 ZR20) but there is a shortage sometimes - my preferred local tyre supplier says direct from Michelin is a delay but available from another supplier easily - Michelin are due more stock in a couple of days apparently.  My car is booked in for next Monday so he will let me know by Friday if he has a further problem with supply.  I don't mind a week or two delay anyway so should be OK.  Blackcircles and National Tyres are two good places to check online for available tyres.

[GTSMarky]

Fair enough - I changed my OEM P Zeros (cracked and horrible) for the latter N1 P Zeros and they're fine although do get a bit hot and slidey on track.

Next time I'll go for the MPS4S which will be later this year after another couple of track days finish these P Zeros off..