Bennyboyc Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 Evening all, picked up a 987.1 S Boxster today and already making plans š¤£ Ā Car has PASM so is already 10mm lower than standard. So Iād planned to just stick some 7/15mm spacers on it, but Iām not convinced I donāt want to lower it a bit moreā¦ So my questions areā¦ does anybody have spacers on their car with standard PASM they could send some pictures of please? Ā Or if I go down the lowering route, do I need PASM specific springs? Ā Thanks and looking forward to being part of this forum! Ā Cheers, Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul P Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 Not been there so no 1st hand knowledge but I have read that these cars donāt really benefit from going much lower than āpasmā Ā mate of mine just spent a small fortune on a suspension refresh - got talked into āfast roadā shocks / springs by an upselling Indy (and his car ended up featured on their YT channel) and he now has some serious regrets. Ā In his words it went from āgreat to drive but lacking in kerb appealā to ālooks fantastic parked but I donāt like driving it anymore ā of course. Ā Your car / money / choice but honestly I think it depends on your desired outcome.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonewolfgjp Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 7mm front 15mm rear on my old PASM 987.1 You can go a touch lower than the standard PASM height but I canāt remember how low or if you need special springs. Personally if would want to improve your PASM the best money you can spend is on a DSC PASM controller but they are expensive and wonāt make your car any lower š Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted April 12 Author Report Share Posted April 12 Ooh that looks nice! Especially with the sport body stuffā¦ I was worried that spacers may accentuate the arch gap but in those pics at least they appear to visually reduce it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phazed Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 Interesting. I have PASM with standard everything and doesnāt look too different. Having done several track days with the standard PASM, I wouldnāt mess with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie40 Posted April 13 Report Share Posted April 13 My car has PASM & sits on 19" wheels with H & R lowered springs, 15mm spacers rear & 7mm spacers front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninesomething Posted April 13 Report Share Posted April 13 H&R lowering springs are either 10mm lower which is the same as a PASM car or 35mm lower which is quite an increase. Sadly on the .1 cars PASM is a bit half-baked. For example it's a 4 channel system but they released it as a single channel system so instead of each wheel reacting individually they all react together. Also the stock settings were devised on glassy smooth German roads not on our obstacle courses.Ā As Lone says the cure is a DSC sport controller. Expensive but they do come up used - I got mine for less than half price. Total game changer from a driving perspective but does nothing for aesthetics.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted April 13 Author Report Share Posted April 13 2 hours ago, Geordie40 said: My car has PASM & sits on 19" wheels with H & R lowered springs, 15mm spacers rear & 7mm spacers front. Thatās the look right there! Is it bone shaking though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phazed Posted April 13 Report Share Posted April 13 Went out for a nice drive today with my wife in the 987 with PASM on standard setting. Even given the condition of the country roads around Surrey the ride was excellent. Especially compared to my 986 with H&R 10 mm lowered springs, and. Bilstein B6 dampers. The 987 is limousine like by comparison! Iām running 19 inch wheels as well so wouldnāt have expected the ride to be as good as it is. I would never run sport setting on the road as it is far too firm but excellent on the perfect surface race tracks.Ā Ā I look forward to having a ride in a car with the DSC controller and doing a back to back as in my mind I canāt see how it could be that much better, (happy to be convinced). If anyone has ever driven a BMW Z4, especially with sport setting, the ride is appalling, hard as nails by comparison! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonewolfgjp Posted April 13 Report Share Posted April 13 I m a big fan of PASM, quite underrated on the forum but I think it is perfect for our crappie UK roads. I noticed a big difference going from a 986 to a 987.1 with PASM, but found the Sport setting way too firm but as the PASM is permanently active it is adjusting all the time in non Sport mode. When I had my 987.2 I managed to find a used DSC controller for a reasonable price and wow what a difference that made! It made the suspension a lot more responsive and adjusted to give you the best ride possible, so much so that I used to drive everywhere in Sport mode as it was firm but controlled adjusted and kept the ride compliant even on bumpy roads. Very very impressive šš 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie40 Posted April 14 Report Share Posted April 14 On 4/13/2024 at 3:06 PM, Bennyboyc said: Thatās the look right there! Is it bone shaking though? Not overly so but the state of the roads around Devon make it difficult to tell, I have been looking for a DSC controller but cheapest I've found so far is still Ā£800 which is a little expensive as car is a weekend toy really. The car is on 35mm lowered springs if your interested Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninesomething Posted April 15 Report Share Posted April 15 On 4/13/2024 at 6:49 PM, Lonewolfgjp said: I m a big fan of PASM, quite underrated on the forum but I think it is perfect for our crappie UK roads. I noticed a big difference going from a 986 to a 987.1 with PASM, but found the Sport setting way too firm but as the PASM is permanently active it is adjusting all the time in non Sport mode. When I had my 987.2 I managed to find a used DSC controller for a reasonable price and wow what a difference that made! It made the suspension a lot more responsive and adjusted to give you the best ride possible, so much so that I used to drive everywhere in Sport mode as it was firm but controlled adjusted and kept the ride compliant even on bumpy roads. Very very impressive šš I wasn't that impressed when I first put it on mind you it was used and it came with a custom tune for a 997 GT3. Probably worse than stock. I downloaded the official 987 tune and it was better but the ride was still plenty firm so I did my own demon tune up. If all else fails read the manual. I had programmed in some values that were outside the available range so the poor thing got confused. In my defence it doesn't tell you in the manual what the available range is. Reading something somewhere I realised where I'd gone wrong. Retuned it and wow. First thing was that going slowly over bumps in town you can actually feel the damping working rather than it just crashing into potholes. (We have our fair share hereabouts) The revelation happened in sport mode though. It feels like cheating to just throw it into any corner at any speed and not even have to use my (limited) skills to make it do whatever I ask. I also forget sometimes that I've left it in sport mode when going slowly. A permanent marker on the dash would help. The downside is that I used to be able to punch it out of corners and hang the back out a bit but there's so much traction now you have to try really hard at speeds that are frankly a bit daft on the road. On one closed, private bit of test track officer I use a guy was coming the other way on a sports bike. He turned round in the road and came after me. Poor bloke - I slowed down twice to let him catch up and have another go. To be honest the road was slightly damp in places and I probably wouldn't have gone any faster on a bike but he was just a dot...Ā In the end he turned off. It just seems like the harder you push it the better it feels. It really wants taking on a track to figure out what it can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonewolfgjp Posted April 15 Report Share Posted April 15 I got lucky with mine, the previous owner had it fitted at Center Gravity and it was turned for the 987šš 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pothole Posted April 18 Report Share Posted April 18 If you want to lower it, use Boxster Spyder springs. The H&R and Eibach kits are too low on the front axle. The Boxster Spyder / Cayman R were set as low as you can practically go with the factory arms before running into problems with travel and geometry. You have to be quite careful lowering a strut based car like a 987. Struts have a fairly narrow operating range in terms of maintaining geometry not just in terms of setup but in terms of dynamically when you are driving. But it's the reduced travel that really kills the drive. Neither the H&R nor the Eibach lowering kits are stiff - barely any stiffer than the factory springs. But they set the car too low and the suspension simply can't operate properly. That's what compromises the ride and why people often say their car has been spoiled. It's a little variable and some cars end up worse than others for some reason. And you can mostly or entirely fix it by adding some extra spring pads. But much better to just get some springs with the right spec in the first place. The Spyder / R springs likewise aren't terribly stiff. But they allow the suspension to actually operate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninesomething Posted April 19 Report Share Posted April 19 13 hours ago, Pothole said: If you want to lower it, use Boxster Spyder springs. The H&R and Eibach kits are too low on the front axle. The Boxster Spyder / Cayman R were set as low as you can practically go with the factory arms before running into problems with travel and geometry. You have to be quite careful lowering a strut based car like a 987. Struts have a fairly narrow operating range in terms of maintaining geometry not just in terms of setup but in terms of dynamically when you are driving. But it's the reduced travel that really kills the drive. Neither the H&R nor the Eibach lowering kits are stiff - barely any stiffer than the factory springs. But they set the car too low and the suspension simply can't operate properly. That's what compromises the ride and why people often say their car has been spoiled. It's a little variable and some cars end up worse than others for some reason. And you can mostly or entirely fix it by adding some extra spring pads. But much better to just get some springs with the right spec in the first place. The Spyder / R springs likewise aren't terribly stiff. But they allow the suspension to actually operate. Yeah I did this on my last Subaru. Lowered it to where the geometry was outside of it's working range. Whiteline sold me some offset brackets that put it back to where it was working properly. š Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted April 26 Author Report Share Posted April 26 I assume that if I replaced the standard PASM springs (10mm lower than standard) with H&R 10mm lowering springs the car would stay at the same height? Or is theĀ PASM lowered height achieved via shorted dampers, or something else, hence fitting the H&R 10mm lowering springs would reduce my PASM car by a further 10mm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phazed Posted April 27 Report Share Posted April 27 Dampers are dampers. Fitting same height springs wonāt change anything. The car will remain at the same height. I havenāt had any firsthand experience of fitting even lower springs with your existing dampers but I would imagine that just a 10 mm additional drop would be fine and the dampers would cope with that. No doubt it will give you a firmer ride. Is that what you want?Ā Personally, I canāt see the advantage over standard which I think is great.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninesomething Posted April 27 Report Share Posted April 27 On 4/26/2024 at 11:17 AM, Bennyboyc said: I assume that if I replaced the standard PASM springs (10mm lower than standard) with H&R 10mm lowering springs the car would stay at the same height? Or is theĀ PASM lowered height achieved via shorted dampers, or something else, hence fitting the H&R 10mm lowering springs would reduce my PASM car by a further 10mm? Yeah you'll be the same with the H&R -10s.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGI_J Posted May 10 Report Share Posted May 10 Bit late, but my 987.1 is PASM & H&R 10mm lowering (if I recall) which is imo perfect.Ā I'm now the lucky guy who is having to potentially replace it all, but I can't find the 10mm lowering springs for the life of me! Only the 35mm ones. Does anyone have a source/link for these?Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted May 10 Author Report Share Posted May 10 6 minutes ago, TGI_J said: Bit late, but my 987.1 is PASM & H&R 10mm lowering (if I recall) which is imo perfect.Ā I'm now the lucky guy who is having to potentially replace it all, but I can't find the 10mm lowering springs for the life of me! Only the 35mm ones. Does anyone have a source/link for these?Ā So would that make your car 10mm or 20mm lower than a car without PASM? Ā PASM is 10mm lower than standard car without PASM, so do you have H&R 10mm springs specifically for a PASM car, ie a further 10mm lowering? Perhaps you could measure the height of the wheel arch so I can compare to my car? Looks lower than mine in the picture but does yours have spacers? They have the effect of visually lowering the car a little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGI_J Posted May 10 Report Share Posted May 10 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Bennyboyc said: So would that make your car 10mm or 20mm lower than a car without PASM? Ā PASM is 10mm lower than standard car without PASM, so do you have H&R 10mm springs specifically for a PASM car, ie a further 10mm lowering? Perhaps you could measure the height of the wheel arch so I can compare to my car? Looks lower than mine in the picture but does yours have spacers? They have the effect of visually lowering the car a little In my head, it would be 20mm lower than a car without PASM. Maybe it is worth measuring. How should I measure? From the ground to the top of the arch?Ā Will have to check all my receipts again, as I never did it myself but a previous owner did. It's definitely lower than just the PASMĀ Ā It does also have spacers, from memory 20 on the rear, 10 on the front. But I can measure those alsoĀ Edited May 10 by TGI_J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted May 10 Author Report Share Posted May 10 1 hour ago, TGI_J said: In my head, it would be 20mm lower than a car without PASM. Maybe it is worth measuring. How should I measure? From the ground to the top of the arch?Ā Will have to check all my receipts again, as I never did it myself but a previous owner did. It's definitely lower than just the PASMĀ Ā It does also have spacers, from memory 20 on the rear, 10 on the front. But I can measure those alsoĀ Yeah centre of the arch to the floor would be great. Personally I think youāve got 30mm lowering springs there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted May 11 Author Report Share Posted May 11 Just measured mine this morning - 67.5cm front, 70cm rear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGI_J Posted May 11 Report Share Posted May 11 9 hours ago, Bennyboyc said: Just measured mine this morning - 67.5cm front, 70cm rear Mine isĀ 64cm at the front,Ā 67cm at the rear, 10mm spacers at the front, 20mm spacers at the back, Not sure what rim/tyre combo you have, but I have 19inch Lobster Claws, PS4S, 235/35 R19 front, 265/35 R19 rear, pretty chunky sidewall which helps with the look.Ā Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennyboyc Posted May 11 Author Report Share Posted May 11 3 minutes ago, TGI_J said: Mine isĀ 64cm at the front,Ā 67cm at the rear, 10mm spacers at the front, 20mm spacers at the back, Not sure what rim/tyre combo you have, but I have 19inch Lobster Claws, PS4S, 235/35 R19 front, 265/35 R19 rear, pretty chunky sidewall which helps with the look.Ā Same tyre profiles. So pretty conclusive - you have 30mm lowering springsĀ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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