Handling

[Clivescoobydo]

On 20 November 2017 at 1:03 PM, james_ly said:

Rear alignment should be very cheap, if that fixes your problem that's a result

Have come from 4 wheel drives, Impreza WRX and Golf R, my Boxster feels kinda 'wallow'e' to me. I was expecting the S to be a hardish ride but it's actually very comfortable over road bumps, which makes me think there's something not quite right. I'll get the alignment and suspension rechecked at GT One in due course. In the meantime I could do with a wide open space where I could play around in safety and find where the edge with these new tyres in both the dry and wet.

[james_ly]

11 hours ago, Clivescoobydo said:

Have come from 4 wheel drives, Impreza WRX and Golf R, my Boxster feels kinda 'wallow'e' to me. I was expecting the S to be a hardish ride but it's actually very comfortable over road bumps, which makes me think there's something not quite right. I'll get the alignment and suspension rechecked at GT One in due course. In the meantime I could do with a wide open space where I could play around in safety and find where the edge with these new tyres in both the dry and wet.

Yep I have the same thing with mine - but my other car has track suspension so I think I just need to recalibrate.

[Clivescoobydo]

Got to the bottom of the handling issues.....I hope!   Had new tyres fitted and geo checked back in November and at the time it was not out by much so I thought I would wait for the service in April and get it done properly at an Indy local to me GT one.  Couple of weeks go by and I then hear a bang from the front RH as I go over a smallish pot hole and the after that a bang (metal on metal) every time I go over a rut or sunken drain, not nice as I'm swerving all over the road to avoid them.  So I book it into GT one early to get the geo checked and fix the knock.  Turns out the Indy that changed the front coil springs a year earlier had forgot to install the washer under the nut on the front right hand mount and eventually the shock punctured through the rubber mount! Basically FA was holding the front RH shock, very dangerous and I was lucky. So after this was rebuilt and I had the LH replaced as well, both front wishbone lower arms, both front lower control arms (coffin arms), front near side outer tie rod replaced (split gaiter), on the rear both track rods rear axle and both wishbone lower arms. All had to be cut off as eccentric bolts were seized preventing geo adjustment.  So after all this they did the geo and could not get the LH or RH front castor in tolerance and the LH camber which is only just out.  Car now drives beautifully without any squeaks, Knocks, vagueness, and rides the potholes, ruts and speed humps without any groaning. I haven't pushed it as its been wet and cold but it also handles so much better so overall I'm pleased with what GT one have done,  just a little disappointed they could get all the set up within tolerance.  Has anyone else found this when they have had there geo done?

[K.I.T.T.]

@Clivescoobydo, are you still on the stock shock absorbers at the front? Take it they survived the dodgy installation unscathed?

I too have an issue with the OSF caster which is out by a tiny margin. Cath, my specialist suggested it is probably the shock absorber as the bottom mount is a known weak point. I was advised not to worry as it's only just out. The caster is not adjustable unless you have GT3 front coffin arms, but should be in spec without them.

I'd just had the rear coffin arms and tie bars replaced with new bolts. I was in a similar situation with the bolts being seized and the toe out enough to make it outright dangerous when pressing on, even in the dry.

I also had all new front arms and springs fitted 500 miles before doing the rear. It drives great now.

[edc]

On most cars with high mileage now the suspension sags so the ride height is lower than when new. This has the knock on effect of reducing the amount of adjustability you have between rear toe and camber. It then becomes a trade off as you can never get the optimal rear geo. One way round it of course is new springs and dampers but the other is to get adjustable rear toe links.

[james_ly]

Any pics of the broken top mount? Scary stuff!

[Clivescoobydo]

Hi KITT yes still on the original shocks all round, they were tired looking but no problem with function so they cleaned them and put some paint protection on them. GT one said the same not worry about it as its only the castor. Mine were RH 7.07 and LH 7.29, the target is +8.00 +/- 0.30. Also the rear LH camber was slightly out 1.52 and the target is 1.20 +/- .30. Mine now drives great to. 

Thanks EDC yes I think changing more would have solved it, but suspension work is an expensive business and as the cars now driving great maybe in the future. GT one also agreed.

Sorry no pics James but GT one video'd it and it was swinging in the top mount probably 15mm of circular movement! I don't blame the previous owner as it was impossible to see and he had the work done in good faith, it also drove fine when I test drove it.  While it was at GT one they had a good look round it and the rest of the car is in great condition other than the usual wear and tear of a 15 year old car. 

 

[Menoporsche]

19 hours ago, Clivescoobydo said:

 Turns out the Indy that changed the front coil springs a year earlier had forgot to install the washer under the nut on the front right hand mount and eventually the shock punctured through the rubber mount!

Holy moly!  There are some things you just can't account for. Glad you found it and all is well now.

[edc]

1 hour ago, Clivescoobydo said:

Hi KITT yes still on the original shocks all round, they were tired looking but no problem with function so they cleaned them and put some paint protection on them. GT one said the same not worry about it as its only the castor. Mine were RH 7.07 and LH 7.29, the target is +8.00 +/- 0.30. Also the rear LH camber was slightly out 1.52 and the target is 1.20 +/- .30. Mine now drives great to. 

Thanks EDC yes I think changing more would have solved it, but suspension work is an expensive business and as the cars now driving great maybe in the future. GT one also agreed.

Sorry no pics James but GT one video'd it and it was swinging in the top mount probably 15mm of circular movement! I don't blame the previous owner as it was impossible to see and he had the work done in good faith, it also drove fine when I test drove it.  While it was at GT one they had a good look round it and the rest of the car is in great condition other than the usual wear and tear of a 15 year old car. 

 

I'm un/fortunate enough to have done a full suspension overhaul on 2 Boxsters now. I don't know how many miles is on your car but if you are happy with the handling aand all is in ok fettle then leave the springs and dampers alone. But if you are in the quest for a great handling car then without doubt you will benefit from a decent set of new dampers. I've done it at 65k and 115k with M030 and Konid FSD/H&R and both times the car has been markedly improved. The dampers and springs were perfectly useable.

[K.I.T.T.]

@edc is there a good source for H&R springs these days? You used to be able to get a set of H&R 'M030 spec' (ie -10mm) for circa £150 a year ago. They're now three times as much. I too have been flirting with the idea of new shocks at some point and have had the FSDs in mind.

I may just try and find some new OE rear springs (or leave alone?) as I replaced the fronts with OE last Jan when one snapped and new dampers all round. Really, I should probably visit Centre Gravity or somewhere and put it on a shock dyno. Whilst they are on over 120k, the car drives well and I'm not sure if it's just a psychological for new dampers. It doesn't feel like it needs them. I do have new arms all round though with only 7k miles on, so that would bring it to factory-fresh spec. Like I said, probably in my mind...

[edc]

I'm not intending to buy H&R springs again anytime soon do haven't researched any alternative suppliers. Do go to Center Gravity for the learning experience. If your car is feeling ok handling wise then I'd bet the damper rig will show they are operating within parameters and are otherwise consistent and fine with each other. My dampers on both cars showed like this. Both times I still replaced them and both times I noticed a good difference. Quite honestly unless as an owner you are pushing the car to notice these things you won't notice it on most drives. I'd bet that if most drives are with a passenger then you'd also not notice (as you tend to drive well within the limits). 

[PaulQ]

-10 h&r for the 986 are no longer available afaik, only the 987 last time I looked.

Did my rear shocks a few months ago, as one had been lightly misting for a while, and even with my new geo, there not much difference at all Imo.

Wouldn't bother with the springs either, unless they have sagged unevenly, or are broken, you'll just end up with a little more negative camber if the car is lower. 

[the baron]

On 14/11/2017 at 2:59 PM, Clivescoobydo said:

Thanks for all your feedback dudes.  First things first new tyres ordered. Goodyear do a £65 for 18" or £80 for 19" pre Xmas cashback at Merit tyres so wish me luck. For what its worth they do a free alignment check so I'll see what they find, I'll then go to a specialist:

265/35R18 97Y GOODYR F1 ASY3 XL	£151.40	2	£302.80
225/40R18 92Y GOODYR F1 ASY3 XL	£98.56	2	£197.12
Free Wheel Alignment CHECK – Four Wheels	£0.00	1	£0.00
		Order Total:	£499.92

Those figures don’t work at the price you said, they are £151 each, unless I’m being blonde

[Clivescoobydo]

57 minutes ago, the baron said:

Those figures don’t work at the price you said, they are £151 each, unless I’m being blonde

? They're lifted from the actual bill and I double checked......which shade of blonde would you like ? The £65 was a separate cash back after they were purchased, making the final price I paid £434.92 ?