Replacing front shocks without unbolting the coffin arms. Is that a thing??

[Filbee]

I just replaced my front shocks and springs with Koni Special Actives and H&R "M030" springs.

Before starting the job I watched and read just about every guide on t'interweb and they all seemed to point to having to release the inner bolts of the coffin arms to enable you be able to pull the shock and hub assembly out of the wheel arch. 

I ended up ignoring all that advice and after removing the caliper and disc I simply popped the coffin arm to hub carrier and track rod (steering arm) ball joints apart, unbolted the ARB link and undid the 3 shock mount nuts under the drunk lid and out came the whole lot 👌

I had to lever the coffin arm down a little to get the ball joint shaft to clear the hub carrier but it was only a big of gentle pressure and was all pretty straightforward with seemingly a lot less hassle than unbolting the coffin arm from the front subframe!

Certainly it was a lot easier than removing the pinch bolt/ARB link arm bolt from the nearside hub carrier 🥵

That took Plus Gas, a big hammer, heat, cutting the ARB link end off the pinch bolt so I could get the impact gun on there and finally it came out!

Hope that helps someone else contemplating the same job 👍

[½cwt]

The point of only slackening but not removing the inner coffin arm bolts is that the whole hub and strut assembly remains supported on the coffin arm, and avoids splitting the ball joint, which can damage the rubber on the ball joint (depending on the tool used), thus requiring a new coffin arm...  I did my front springs only first and did it the inner bolt slackening method.  When I did the dampers I left them hanging on the top mounts (which I was changing too) so I had gravity working with my whilst freeing the damper tube from the hub.  I was replacing the coffin arms and tuning forks too.

At the end of the day it is each to their own and depending on the whole scope of the work you are doing, different methods may be more suitable, but good to know what options there are.

Edited August 22, 2023 by ½cwt

[Everywhen]

17 hours ago, Filbee said:

Certainly it was a lot easier than removing the pinch bolt/ARB link arm bolt from the nearside hub carrier 🥵

That took Plus Gas, a big hammer, heat, cutting the ARB link end off the pinch bolt so I could get the impact gun on there and finally it came out!

Been there, done that, only recently. It took 4 hrs to get out, millimeter by creaking millimeter!

[Filbee]

7 hours ago, Everywhen said:

Been there, done that, only recently. It took 4 hrs to get out, millimeter by creaking millimeter!

Sounds like a got lucky with mine, as it only took me an hour or so to get mine out!

I managed to bend the bolt from the hammer action which didn't help! I had to cut the bent end off before I could get the thing out.

[bally4563]

Missing the point here chaps, however which way you do it , you still have to remove the drop link, myself as I have replaced copious amounts over the years, would tend to go with the least amount of work / over damage on a component that is probably in good health, ie ball joint dust shields it would appear that the OP had golden balls on that day and not knackering up the bottom wishbone… definitely not a solution I would recommend unless I had deep pockets. The Oracle has now left the building!!😂

[Everywhen]

11 hours ago, Filbee said:

Sounds like a got lucky with mine, as it only took me an hour or so to get mine out!

I managed to bend the bolt from the hammer action which didn't help! I had to cut the bent end off before I could get the thing out.

Like you I cut the ball off and used an impact which promptly rounded it off. So I cut it off and welded a large nut on the threaded end and used that to turn it with a 1m extension bar on the spanner. the leverage was such that I had to sit on the strut spring to keep it from moving.

[Filbee]

11 hours ago, bally4563 said:

Missing the point here chaps, however which way you do it , you still have to remove the drop link, myself as I have replaced copious amounts over the years, would tend to go with the least amount of work / over damage on a component that is probably in good health, ie ball joint dust shields it would appear that the OP had golden balls on that day and not knackering up the bottom wishbone… definitely not a solution I would recommend unless I had deep pockets. The Oracle has now left the building!!😂

Lol 😁

I don't have golden balls but maybe I got lucky or have a decent ball joint splitter that's not damaged a rubber boot (yet). Time will tell I guess! 

After watching a number of videos of people having to cut their seized coffin arm bolts at the subframe to get them off, I reckoned it was likely to be the least destructive way of getting the strut out, and involved undoing the least amount of nuts and bolts. I know the coffin arms will need replacing at some point now my car has passed the 80,000 mile mark but I'll save that joy for another time. You don't really need to have deep pockets with Spyder doing a pair for less than £120 + VAT 👍

As you say, which ever way you do it you will have to tackle the drop link bolt. One site came out with a bit of wiggling and a few taps with a drift. The other not so easily!

[Filbee]

54 minutes ago, Everywhen said:

Like you I cut the ball off and used an impact which promptly rounded it off. So I cut it off and welded a large nut on the threaded end and used that to turn it with a 1m extension bar on the spanner. the leverage was such that I had to sit on the strut spring to keep it from moving.

You certainly were unlucky with yours! I did manage to get a bit of movement by standing on the top end of the strut and pulling the breaker bar, but I think it was the heat and plus gas that did the trick in the end.

[½cwt]

The front coffin arm bolts are less often found to be seized than rears, and the seizing is into the alloy. Ish 8n the coffin arm, so you can slacken the nut, get some movement, then re-tighten the nut on to the seized bolt once you get the arm back to the neutral position.

On the rear, seized bolts prevent alignment adjustments so is a different ball game, the from has. I alignment adjustment on the coffin arm bolt.

[Filbee]

7 hours ago, ½cwt said:

The front coffin arm bolts are less often found to be seized than rears, and the seizing is into the alloy. Ish 8n the coffin arm, so you can slacken the nut, get some movement, then re-tighten the nut on to the seized bolt once you get the arm back to the neutral position.

On the rear, seized bolts prevent alignment adjustments so is a different ball game, the from has. I alignment adjustment on the coffin arm bolt.

Do you not have to take the bolts right out of the coffin arms though, in order to pull the strut assembly out from under the wheel arch? Or am I missing something?

The reason I split the ball joints from the hub carrier and tie rod was to get the hub carrier and strut out in one piece which I reckoned would make separating the strut and the hub carrier easier than it would if it's still attached to the car.

[Nobbie]

29 minutes ago, Filbee said:

Do you not have to take the bolts right out of the coffin arms though, in order to pull the strut assembly out from under the wheel arch? Or am I missing something?

The reason I split the ball joints from the hub carrier and tie rod was to get the hub carrier and strut out in one piece which I reckoned would make separating the strut and the hub carrier easier than it would if it's still attached to the car.

I think once you loosen the bolt, you are no longer twisting the rubber bush to push the other end down.

[½cwt]

1 hour ago, Filbee said:

Do you not have to take the bolts right out of the coffin arms though, in order to pull the strut assembly out from under the wheel arch? Or am I missing something?

The reason I split the ball joints from the hub carrier and tie rod was to get the hub carrier and strut out in one piece which I reckoned would make separating the strut and the hub carrier easier than it would if it's still attached to the car.

The suspension works by the subframe clevis clamping to an alloy (hence the steel/alloy corrosion that can cause it to seize like in the pinch bolt) bush and the rubber in the coffin arm flexes with the rise and fall of the suspension, so it is not just the spring that supports the car, there is assistance from the bush.  If you slacken the bolt you can allow the coffin arm to drop a lot further giving enough clearance for an uncompressed strut to be manoeuvred out under the top of the wheel arch.

[Filbee]

23 hours ago, ½cwt said:

The suspension works by the subframe clevis clamping to an alloy (hence the steel/alloy corrosion that can cause it to seize like in the pinch bolt) bush and the rubber in the coffin arm flexes with the rise and fall of the suspension, so it is not just the spring that supports the car, there is assistance from the bush.  If you slacken the bolt you can allow the coffin arm to drop a lot further giving enough clearance for an uncompressed strut to be manoeuvred out under the top of the wheel arch.

Cool. I knew the first bit but I didn't think you would be able to pull the coffin arm down far enough to get the strut to clear the wheel arch, even if you slackened off the the inner bolt. 

I'm glad I took the whole lot out given the problems I had with the pinch bolt, but I'm wiser now if I want to save some time in the future!

So, are there any easy dodges for the back end then?? 😁

I'm planning on drive shaft nut off, caliper off, drop link disconnected from ARB, toe arm ball joint split, inner coffin arm bolt out, strut mount nuts off and swing the hub and strut out from the arch. 

Now I'm wondering if it's possible to pull the coffin arm low enough to swing the strut out from under the arch it you leave the inner coffin arm bolt loose but not removed and leave the drive shaft nut done up?

[½cwt]

1 hour ago, Filbee said:

Cool. I knew the first bit but I didn't think you would be able to pull the coffin arm down far enough to get the strut to clear the wheel arch, even if you slackened off the the inner bolt. 

I'm glad I took the whole lot out given the problems I had with the pinch bolt, but I'm wiser now if I want to save some time in the future!

So, are there any easy dodges for the back end then?? 😁

I'm planning on drive shaft nut off, caliper off, drop link disconnected from ARB, toe arm ball joint split, inner coffin arm bolt out, strut mount nuts off and swing the hub and strut out from the arch. 

Now I'm wondering if it's possible to pull the coffin arm low enough to swing the strut out from under the arch it you leave the inner coffin arm bolt loose but not removed and leave the drive shaft nut done up?

I disconnected the drive shaft on the inboard end, generating the torque to undo a 345lb ft tightened nut from some 20 years ago frightened me off!

All 4 eccentric bolts on mine were seized on the rear, I was originally hoping to do only the coffin arms but when I found the toe link bolts seized too I knew getting the tracking back to normal setting would be impossible.  To be fair I was doing the dampers and top mounts too so it all had to come out.  I'm pretty sure you wouldn't get the strut out under the arch on the rear as the top mount is much higher up in the arch.  Also, when done I still had a knocking so the tuning forks got done a few months later, then it was all quiet!  I also had a cheap new drop link fail in under 2 years <10k miles; pay the few £ extra for the OE TRW branded ones.  I thought I saved £30 but then bought £90 worth for drop links to make sure all 4 were up to spec. Buy cheap, buy twice.

[Everywhen]

I removed the rear strut without disconnecting the drive shaft, the coffin arms and the Toe link and tuning fork were being replaced so once removed, the hub then dropped low enough to slide the strut out. It was tight but doable. And involved a hammer. Lots of hammer.

[½cwt]

49 minutes ago, Everywhen said:

I removed the rear strut without disconnecting the drive shaft, the coffin arms and the Toe link and tuning fork were being replaced so once removed, the hub then dropped low enough to slide the strut out. It was tight but doable. And involved a hammer. Lots of hammer.

Probably easier to undo the 6 bolts on the inboard drive flange, and in the above scenario the hub will still be attached to the drive shaft so can't be moved off the car.  I found leaving the shaft attached at the out board end heled in removing the damper as there was more mass when trying to knock the hub down to free the damper from its socket in the hub.  You can pull the hub out of the way to get full access to the toe link and coffin arm inner bolts to cut them (you can see the swarf on the ground below) with the hub propped out of the way to avoid breaking the brake lines.

 

[Everywhen]

Arrrg! That photo is alike a bad Acid flashback! It’s brought it all back!

I notice the back plate for the parking brake is missing, does it function ok without it?