the baron Posted November 11, 2020 Report Share Posted November 11, 2020 After 210,000 miles my car might finally need a new clutch, it’s a 2.5 and not looking to change IMS etc as it has the duel row so pretty bomb proof. Anyone had the clutch replaced recently by Porsche specialist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
½cwt Posted November 11, 2020 Report Share Posted November 11, 2020 Someone 'up north' indicated £500 to £550 so may be a bit more in your neck of the woods. Ask Lee. Probably worth considering a new flywheel too at such advanced miles even if well cared for as the will be wear on the friction face as well as on the teeth on the starter ring and if the fly wheel is off, the rear main seal is only a few pounds and minutes more work as it will likely have hardened up over time and may not get to 420,000 miles 😉. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2020 Good advice, am speaking to Lee tomorrow and will suggest your recommendations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edc Posted November 11, 2020 Report Share Posted November 11, 2020 £500 seems quite cheap. Look up the price of a clutch kit, it doesn't leave much left in that price for labour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toddie Posted November 11, 2020 Report Share Posted November 11, 2020 Revolution in Leeds quote £499 for a 2.5 or 2.7 according to their website, plus vat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 56 minutes ago, Toddie said: Revolution in Leeds quote £499 for a 2.5 or 2.7 according to their website, plus vat. I saw that, seems a good deal will use it if Lee is more expensive 😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevs Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Friendsgreen Porsche has it listed at £549 plus VAT for a 996 so I presume it would be about that for a 986 too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
½cwt Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Interesting this with/without VAT thing, I wonder how many of these independents have a majority of VAT registered/business as opposed to retail customers. Should they be pricing incl VAT or at least clearly listing both prices on websites that are really aimed at retail customers? It is one of the factors in me changing indy, at least the one I've used most recently gives total price to pay for a job not sneaking the 20% for HMRC on the end hiking my budget by the odd £100 or so each time. If you get a servicing of repair price from any brand of main dealer you get the price to pay, just because you are not a franchise, why should you be different to retail customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 So spoke with Lee this morning, he's given me a ball park figure of around £700 but he has said without a doubt I should change the IMS even though its duel row and done 210,000 miles without an issue, its just a time and wear thing and it will go and he's seen just as many duel row fail as single so what do you guys think, change the IMS or leave put, that will add another £700 on the bill and that's without touching the flywheel etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
map Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Crikey @the baron £700 for a bearing change - especially as the gearbox and engine are separated for a clutch/flywheel swap. How do they get to that figure? Is it an OE part or one the “upgraded” versions that are available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 @mapThe IMS is a design 911 option around £500 for the part, Im just nervous as its been hassle free and I just don't hear of early cars with duel row having issues however there are not that many that have done my mileage. The cars a keeper and will be handed down to my girls when I cant drive anymore so its not so much the money but equally I don't want to spend money if I don't have too. Equally I could spend that money and the liner could go on the engine which will mean a new engine so its just a hard one to call Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Looking at Revolution, whilst they are a bit cheaper for the clutch replacement at £499 + vat they want £1300 + vat for the IMS so Lee is not looking expensive, If it needs doing at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulQ Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Just buy the bearing yourself for 20 quid, and get them to fit it (presuming they will) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 1 minute ago, PaulQ said: Just buy the bearing yourself for 20 quid, and get them to fit it (presuming they will) If you look on various websites the IMS is very expensive, here's Design 911: https://www.design911.co.uk/fu/prod127645/Intermediate-Shaft-Bearing-Upgrade-Eternal-Fix-IMS-Boxster-986---996---997/?source=doofinder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
map Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 @the baron - my gut instinct would I think push me towards replacing the bearing with a Porsche supplied part. Many (if not all) of the “upgrade” IMSB options are “lifed” in their small print..... Am 100% with you with regard to long term ownership and have made several such upgrade/OE decisions. The most recent was using a brand new IMS and Big Bearing from Porsche when building the 3.2 to 3.7. It just made sense at that time and actually worked out to be more cost effective than the non-Porsche options. So yep, on balance I’d go for a Porsche supplied bearing and just replace it at this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulQ Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 6 minutes ago, the baron said: If you look on various websites the IMS is very expensive, here's Design 911: https://www.design911.co.uk/fu/prod127645/Intermediate-Shaft-Bearing-Upgrade-Eternal-Fix-IMS-Boxster-986---996---997/?source=doofinder Try searching the forum. A few here have done them now. @Berni29 I think is one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southy Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Having dealt with Lee for years, he isn't the guy pushing for IMS changes for a cash stream, as we have spoke about it a lot in the past. He is an engineer by trade so I bet he has thought this through a lot more than most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, Southy said: Having dealt with Lee for years, he isn't the guy pushing for IMS changes for a cash stream, as we have spoke about it a lot in the past. He is an engineer by trade so I bet he has thought this through a lot more than most. Totally on board with your train of thought, I totally trust him and his advice and he has actually saved me thousands through the years I have been using him, I just wanted second opinions on the IMS issues as I have not heard of early 2.5's having an issue in that area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Interesting video: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southy Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, the baron said: Totally on board with your train of thought, I totally trust him and his advice and he has actually saved me thousands through the years I have been using him, I just wanted second opinions on the IMS issues as I have not heard of early 2.5's having an issue in that area. I'm with you on that, and I would also seek opinions here as well, Lee has refused to do a service on my car before due to the low miles completed each year and just recommended an oil change, he said he'll look the car over anyway if they spot something he would let me know. I was at the time alternating between a minor/major service each year, I've been using Cotswolds Porsche for 5 years now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topbox Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 12 minutes ago, the baron said: Equally I could spend that money and the liner could go on the engine which will mean a new engine so its just a hard one to call Well time and wear will make any engine part fail........eventually. Oh for a cyrstal ball. I thought the 2.5 IMS bearings as bullet proof too, but only from what I read. The liner may well go but if the IMS bearing does fail you will kick yourself, more so, as you are doing the clutch. Its a keeper too so . . . . . You have the experience of some older car ownership to help with your decision so are perhaps better qualified than many to make the call. Is there a part of you that just wants to do whats necessary in part ( no pun intended) to see what bits last and what do not or to keep the car on its original bits as long as possible as the miles go higher??? Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 30 minutes ago, Topbox said: Well time and wear will make any engine part fail........eventually. Oh for a cyrstal ball. I thought the 2.5 IMS bearings as bullet proof too, but only from what I read. The liner may well go but if the IMS bearing does fail you will kick yourself, more so, as you are doing the clutch. Its a keeper too so . . . . . You have the experience of some older car ownership to help with your decision so are perhaps better qualified than many to make the call. Is there a part of you that just wants to do whats necessary in part ( no pun intended) to see what bits last and what do not or to keep the car on its original bits as long as possible as the miles go higher??? Good luck. I suppose the quickest answer is I would like to keep the car as originally as possible but equally I don't want to spend cash if unnecessary, but it seems that the general consensus is in line with what Lee has suggested and the IMS upgraded replacement is 5 times stronger so should last me to half a million miles hopefully so Im veering towards doing it at the same time. But I'm very proud of the fact that the car has done 210k miles on the same clutch, engine gearbox etc. and it would have been nice to see how long the IMS stays intact but the only down side with that particular item it will have a catastrophic affect on the car so common sense prevails and it should be changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edc Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 2 hours ago, the baron said: If you look on various websites the IMS is very expensive, here's Design 911: https://www.design911.co.uk/fu/prod127645/Intermediate-Shaft-Bearing-Upgrade-Eternal-Fix-IMS-Boxster-986---996---997/?source=doofinder The aftermarket solutions labeled as IMS are expensive. But there are as already mentioned much cheaper OE equivalent bearings. There used to be an IMS sticky and there were part numbers for NSK and SKF and maybe FAG bearings from what I can remember. A few here have also used the Pelican kit which again is much cheaper than the other aftermarket "solutions". I have the LN ceramic in mine since 2013. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted November 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 3 minutes ago, edc said: The aftermarket solutions labeled as IMS are expensive. But there are as already mentioned much cheaper OE equivalent bearings. There used to be an IMS sticky and there were part numbers for NSK and SKF and maybe FAG bearings from what I can remember. A few here have also used the Pelican kit which again is much cheaper than the other aftermarket "solutions". I have the LN ceramic in mine since 2013. Ive seen those options, around £1300 from Revolution fitted, glad to hear its still working well, I think for piece of mind like you I would opt for an upgraded aftermarket one even though a lot more expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topbox Posted November 12, 2020 Report Share Posted November 12, 2020 Indeed @the baron understand your pride on the milage on original parts, but yes, an IMS failure could be nasty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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