Warranty Woes. Is the dealership being OTT?

[Ninja02]

The rear light is actually the level sensors.  1 on each coffin arm

[Ninja02]

30 minutes ago, topradio said:

This is why I never take out extra warranty, you think that you're covered until you need to claim and you find that you're not. Then you have the stress of arguing with them that things should be covered, I couldn't be arsed with that.

I even deleted the 'optional' third year new car warranty when I bought the 981, I don't think they had ever had somebody do that before. Stick the warranty money in a side account and use it for the stuff that needs fixing.

How many of the plugs are stuck? 

They actually never really said,  TBH didn't push it.  THey were blaming the previous OPC.  I basicaly said,  I don't care who's to blame.  The car has never been anywhere but Porsche,  whether it here or previous.  It is for Porsche to sort out one way or another

[Stuart21UK]

yeah I'd like to know why rear and front lights need replacing too...

[Ringer250]

@Ninja02 Ouch! Hope this gets sorted on Monday Phil. 🤞

[map]

10 hours ago, Ninja02 said:

Possibly,  with them only just opening,,  trying not to rock the boat too much with Porsche.  Shall see what they have to say on Monday.  Not being able to remove the spark plugs will be an arguement .  I can see it

Ah that's the OPC just off the Humber Bridge then.

Had been thinking I needed a 111 point check on my car - just to make sure it's all OK - if they can dream up a set of recommendations like that for yours I cannot wait to see the list they'd produce for my scabby 986 😂

On a more serious note I know of two poor service/high cost examples at this place and in these cases they're seriously considering moving outside the OPC network as a direct result - am only aware because my friends who are the owners of these cars spoke to me about it asking for non-OPC recommendations.

Called Humber Bridge OPC myself last week for a 986 rear suspension headlamp levelling linkage - it's an alloy bar barely 10mm across and 100mm long with a small bearing at each end: £55.00 - a couple of years ago I "distress purchased" one for the front, same design only shorter, it was £15 including the nuts - yep the £55 didn't include those...

It's almost as if they're trying to irritate their target market - expensive combined with seemingly poor service - appreciate they've only just opened so some teething troubles might be understandable.  Regardless expecting the customer to pay for them directly seems a bit rich and at odds with my experience of running a business.

@frozen they're part of the Lister group.

[lofi]

Be interested on why the headlights need replacing.  If it is the usual crazing I know getting a porsche warranty put on mine, not paying out the cost of the warranty to replace them so I can get a warranty, that would be nuts!

[Carmand]

Unfortunately your situation is all too common from what I have read and experienced albeit on a minor level.  

My car is under extended warranty as I consider the premium to be reasonable given the potential downside if anything serious were to fail.  When the car was in for its 4 year service and renewal in February I pointed out that two zip ties holding some of the exhaust heat shielding had corroded through and that I would like these replaced.  Bearing in mind that I was spending a considerable sum of money for the service and renewal plus several other discretionary jobs, and this was a simple task I assumed that this would not be an issue  - I wouldn't necessarily have quibbled about who paid for it.  

However when I came to collect the car the response (which I had to ask for) was Porsche did not sell the zip ties as a separate part and the only way to fix the issue would be to order a whole new exhaust - the implication being this would be at my cost.  Naturally I did not consider this to be a proportionate solution to a minor issue, which none the less did need fixing - the OPC seemed quite happy to shrug their shoulders and let me drive away without anything being done.  At my insistence they committed to follow up the Porsche - of course I heard nothing.

In the mean time I realised that I had not received any documentation relating to my Warranty renewal and I queried this with Porsche - cue phone call from OPC Service Manager - profuse apologies, sorry we forgot to process your application....

Several weeks after all of this I received a follow up call asking for a favourable response to the Customer Satisfaction survey I was about to receive - when I pointed out that I was clearly not satisfied after a bit of umming and erring I was told that Porsche had confirmed that the only solution was a new exhaust.  I then wrote a polite note to Porsche Customer Services pointing out that I did not expect to have a prolonged discussion about the replacement of 2 rusted zip ties on a 4 year old car that has done less than 9k miles and is kept garaged.

24 hours later an email arrives from the OPC asking when I would like to book the car in to fix the issue - fortunately I held off taking the car as this was around lockdown and the car would likely have been marooned.  I am assuming the fix will be something less than a new exhaust.

I've now tried all 3 OPCs that are local to me and not had what I would call Customer Service from any of them (far better experience with my daily runarounds from VW and Mini) - I'm not looking for bowing and scraping just a basic level of competence and genuine interest in me as a customer.  

I've owned a Porsche since the mid 90s when I bought my 968 Club Sport so have seen the deterioration of the whole ownership experience over that time.  Having worked in the motor trade for 5 years during my career (including for 2 OPCs at one stage) I''ve a pretty good understanding of how the business works.  Clearly post covid there will be significant changes to the industry as whole (the recent events at Bentley and Aston Martin are just the start at the premium end I feel) and unless the OPC infrastructure as a whole start to move with he times they simply won't survive - people will take their money elsewhere.

I'll still have my car in 2022 and I'll need to decide whether I stay in the network for warranty and service then - at the moment the jury is out.

On your car I'd be asking whether the items in question (lights in particular) are an MOT issue - if not why are they failing a warranty check.  And how do lights wear out?  If you don't get a sensible response from Porsche (and I'd take it up direct with them if the OPC don't respond positively) then tell them you will take the issue to the Small Claims Court as being supplied when not fit for purpose.

[frozen]

2 hours ago, map said:

Ah that's the OPC just off the Humber Bridge then.

Had been thinking I needed a 111 point check on my car - just to make sure it's all OK - if they can dream up a set of recommendations like that for yours I cannot wait to see the list they'd produce for my scabby 986 😂

On a more serious note I know of two poor service/high cost examples at this place and in these cases they're seriously considering moving outside the OPC network as a direct result - am only aware because my friends who are the owners of these cars spoke to me about it asking for non-OPC recommendations.

Called Humber Bridge OPC myself last week for a 986 rear suspension headlamp levelling linkage - it's an alloy bar barely 10mm across and 100mm long with a small bearing at each end: £55.00 - a couple of years ago I "distress purchased" one for the front, same design only shorter, it was £15 including the nuts - yep the £55 didn't include those...

It's almost as if they're trying to irritate their target market - expensive combined with seemingly poor service - appreciate they've only just opened so some teething troubles might be understandable.  Regardless expecting the customer to pay for them directly seems a bit rich and at odds with my experience of running a business.

@frozen they're part of the Lister group.

noted - I guess there's a lot of the dealers trying to squeeze customers at the moment. Very short sighted solution to the current situation with obvious longer term negative consequences. 

My turn to find out sept/oct this year how my lot are behaving

[½cwt]

The acid test on any of these would be the expected life.  If they are 'short' life they should be in the service schedule and therefore apparent in running costs that an owner can check, like cam belt replacements with water pump etc. so ask them where the schedule is for changing these apparently 'high wear parts' and where they fall in the age/mileage ranges , otherwise they are 'fit for life' parts so you have  an early life failure which should be a warranty item unless specifically excluded in the text of the warranty policy..  I don't know about Porsche but this is suggested by other manufacturers as at least 10 years/100k mile (or 150k KM).  Also there is a difference between failure and changing a part and choosing to refresh a part as those of us that own the older cars often choose to do work.  The way this is presented so far seem to be that the OPC says they need changing as opposed to advise a change. 

If they don't budge revert to writing/email and copy Reading in on all the correspondence.  As others have said what appear to be lower value brands seem to have higher customer service values.

Good Luck!

[JohnSyn]

I'm not sure whether there is a pattern or its just pot luck getting someone sympathetic. I'm driving the first Porsche I've owned with extended warranty. All my other cars were purchased new with Porsche warranty. When there was ever a fault, with any of my new cars, it was fixed under warranty without any question. In fact on both the 981S and 981 Spyder they replaced the whole roof whereas I would have been happy with a repair! This experience seems at odds with what both the OP, @Ninja02, and others have relayed. Maybe it's the extended warranty, or maybe Porsches customer care standards are reducing. Either way this has convinced me that if I do keep my 981GTS I will not pay for an extended warranty!

@Ninja02 I really hope they treat you properly on this. 

[Ninja02]

Thanks for all the positive comments, 

Regarding the lights,  the headlight is what I raised with them prior to the inspection, it is crazing around the edge of the light. consequently they have then picked up on it.  The rear lights,  it has nothing to do with the rear lights, so why they have listed it under thst heading.  It is the level sensors which I think are for the PASM (1 at each wheel).  They've said all 4.  Would be suprised if all 4 have siezed, and if so, why hasn't the car displayed an error?.  Not sure.  Questions to ask, andI'll expect a good explanatory reason.  So ATM,  I'll bide my time and wait for a full explanation on Monday.

Phill

[Ninja02]

5 minutes ago, JohnSyn said:

I'm not sure whether there is a pattern or its just pot luck getting someone sympathetic. I'm driving the first Porsche I've owned with extended warranty. All my other cars were purchased new with Porsche warranty. When there was ever a fault, with any of my new cars, it was fixed under warranty without any question. In fact on both the 981S and 981 Spyder they replaced the whole roof whereas I would have been happy with a repair! This experience seems at odds with what both the OP, @Ninja02, and others have relayed. Maybe it's the extended warranty, or maybe Porsches customer care standards are reducing. Either way this has convinced me that if I do keep my 981GTS I will not pay for an extended warranty!

@Ninja02 I really hope they treat you properly on this. 

Upon a satisfactory resolution of this matter,  I'm still thinking of renewing the warranty.   I got an estimate from warrantywise (endorsed by Quentin Wilson).  For the year,  that was £1700.  Ouch.  So,  TBH £1200 for 2 yrs is not a bad price (as long as they deliver).  All you need is an ECU to fry  (without externasl influences of course LOL), and that's your £1200 and more well spent

[JohnSyn]

28 minutes ago, Ninja02 said:

Upon a satisfactory resolution of this matter,  I'm still thinking of renewing the warranty.   I got an estimate from warrantywise (endorsed by Quentin Wilson).  For the year,  that was £1700.  Ouch.  So,  TBH £1200 for 2 yrs is not a bad price (as long as they deliver).  All you need is an ECU to fry  (without externasl influences of course LOL), and that's your £1200 and more well spent

If it works for you Phill then great

its just a shame you’ve got this angst at the moment 

[map]

@JohnSyn - the difference between and Porsche New car warranty and a Porsche Extended/Used car warranty is - as I understand it - that the New car warranty is underwritten by Porsche HQ Germany.  The Extended/Used warranty is a Porsche GB warranty so maybe the attitude to underwriter’s cost is more belligerent - sorry I meant robust. 

[daz05]

I repaired a seized leveling sensor on our X5, a couple of bolts to remove and some TLC and all is well again. Warranty is good for the big stuff but when you have the wear and tear argument to deal with you are probably better off using a mechanic that doesn't have to follow the replacement over repair policy.

 

Same with your light got it rubbed down and reapply a clear coat or get @RobPorsche981 on here to stick some tint on it, he's only done it 300 times.

[JohnSyn]

1 hour ago, map said:

@JohnSyn - the difference between and Porsche New car warranty and a Porsche Extended/Used car warranty is - as I understand it - that the New car warranty is underwritten by Porsche HQ Germany.  The Extended/Used warranty is a Porsche GB warranty so maybe the attitude to underwriter’s cost is more belligerent - sorry I meant robust. 

Hi Matthew

Thanks for this. I did know the difference but thought the extended warranty was insurance backed. Nevertheless its not good there is such a difference, as you say it's clear there is a much more belligerent and/or robust approach. Doesn't do much for Porsches ratings!

[R1HJK]

Interesting read as my car is booked in to have some warranty work. It will be the second time. First time was hassle free, everything was fixed within the day and car was picked up fault free.

My car has a headlight fault which keeps appearing on the dash, I have also noticed the crazing at the top. So it will be interesting what they say. If the issue is only cosmetic and not impacting the operation of the headlight I wouldn’t expect it to get replaced. As I have a fault with my headlight I’m expecting it to be fixed under warranty, if that means a new headlight then that should be covered.

Coming from a number of BMWs they have always honoured their warranties. I had condensation in one headlight which was replaced without question. Final bill was around £1.5k but covered under warranty. 

[Stuart21UK]

9 hours ago, map said:

@JohnSyn - the difference between and Porsche New car warranty and a Porsche Extended/Used car warranty is - as I understand it - that the New car warranty is underwritten by Porsche HQ Germany.  The Extended/Used warranty is a Porsche GB warranty so maybe the attitude to underwriter’s cost is more belligerent - sorry I meant robust. 

new car = Porsche versus insurance backed for the extended warranty (and you aren't even covered properly by the Financial Ombudsman as I found out!)

10 hours ago, Ninja02 said:

Upon a satisfactory resolution of this matter,  I'm still thinking of renewing the warranty.   I got an estimate from warrantywise (endorsed by Quentin Wilson).  For the year,  that was £1700.  Ouch.  So,  TBH £1200 for 2 yrs is not a bad price (as long as they deliver).  All you need is an ECU to fry  (without externasl influences of course LOL), and that's your £1200 and more well spent

IMO the warranty is good only for the big things and ultimately if an engine blows up then you should still expect some good will or residual protection from consumer law I believe

if you consider the £4000 bill then take out the tyres and mot cost, also the service then you wouldnt have been any worse off not having the warranty and using the savings of warranty to pretty much cover the work that ACTUALLY needs doing, cue @topradio who's a staunch advocate for self insuring (and I'm now with him on that)  

...plus the cheek to expect you to pay for a 111 point inspection before then charging you to renew is the most arrogant business practice I know

[daz05]

Self confessed self insurer here also.  In my experience warranty success rate on the more controversial items is directly linked to your relationship with the dealer.  If they want to keep you sweet they will go that extra mile to put your claim through the system.

[Greenman]

I’ve had two (smallish) items addressed on extended warranty with no suggestion of it not being warranty issues, (1 active engine mount, and interior fan regulator pack). Smallish items but cost more than justified warranty.

[Stuart21UK]

12 hours ago, Greenman said:

I’ve had two (smallish) items addressed on extended warranty with no suggestion of it not being warranty issues, (1 active engine mount, and interior fan regulator pack). Smallish items but cost more than justified warranty.

there's the thing though....

Porsche with their brilliant customer service could easily have said that both of those were 'due to wear and tear', but fortunately didnt 

There's no consistency, many OPCs (and moreso Porsche) just seem to treat us as cash cows

[ATM]

On 6/6/2020 at 10:16 AM, Ninja02 said:

Thanks for all the positive comments, 

Regarding the lights,  the headlight is what I raised with them prior to the inspection, it is crazing around the edge of the light. consequently they have then picked up on it.  The rear lights,  it has nothing to do with the rear lights, so why they have listed it under thst heading.  It is the level sensors which I think are for the PASM (1 at each wheel).  They've said all 4.  Would be suprised if all 4 have siezed, and if so, why hasn't the car displayed an error?.  Not sure.  Questions to ask, andI'll expect a good explanatory reason.  So ATM,  I'll bide my time and wait for a full explanation on Monday.

Phill

I have these level sensors at both ends and I have no PASM. Might be PSM related.

 

[daz05]

Level sensors are there to keep the lights pointing at the right level when the suspension is loaded and unloaded, not related to pasm, pasm adjusts the dampers based on the road surface. Every car with xenon's has level sensors fitted.

[Ninja02]

10 hours ago, daz05 said:

Level sensors are there to keep the lights pointing at the right level when the suspension is loaded and unloaded, not related to pasm, pasm adjusts the dampers based on the road surface. Every car with xenon's has level sensors fitted.

Daz.  Thanks for clarifying this

Phill

[daz05]

58 minutes ago, Ninja02 said:

Daz.  Thanks for clarifying this

Phill

No worries, these are a very simple mechanism and usually held on with a couple of small bolts,  as I said I had the same issue on our X5, they were seized but was able to remove them to apply penetrating fluid and manually moved them back and forward to remove the corrosion within the mechanism.  A regular garage would do the same but the OPC has to replace, because this issue is caused by corrosion rather than failure most warranties would not cover.

Note for the rest of us get some protecting spray on these now before you get an MOT failure for your headlights lights pointing low.