edc Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 8 minutes ago, gIzzE said: The 986 will easily become much more valuable than the 987, and it won't be long before it does either. Look at the way 996's are suddenly starting to go up in value, they are now becoming retro cool, and when that happens. Agree with this and not because I have a 986. Before the 981 and 718 people bought the 987 because it was newer, more modern, supposedly nicer interior, newer so more reliable, etc. These qualities are diminishing ever more. The only 987s that will have strong prices are the Spyder and Cayman R, perhaps too the RS60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gIzzE Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 Exactly. The issue is, while the 986 and 996 interiors are starting to look 'classic' the 987 is starting to look old. That of course will change over time and will start to feel more classic as well. But the 986 and 996 will always be the first, first water cooled car that still feels very analogue and of course the first Boxster. This is now starting to appeal to many.... I'm looking for a 911, and I will either go 996 or 991, the 987 doesn't have any appeal to me any more. Not something I would have said only 12 months ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TV8 Posted December 15, 2020 Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 21 minutes ago, gIzzE said: Exactly. The issue is, while the 986 and 996 interiors are starting to look 'classic' the 987 is starting to look old. That of course will change over time and will start to feel more classic as well. But the 986 and 996 will always be the first, first water cooled car that still feels very analogue and of course the first Boxster. This is now starting to appeal to many.... I'm looking for a 911, and I will either go 996 or 991, the 987 doesn't have any appeal to me any more. Not something I would have said only 12 months ago. I agree. I didn’t want a 911 or a 996 version having had a 987 up to the time of getting mine but I have really fallen for the car, including the rear spoiler which isn’t normally my sort of thing. The centre console delete looks great, especially with the orange lit continental head unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
½cwt Posted December 16, 2020 Report Share Posted December 16, 2020 The quality and finish of the interior materials, particularly plastics, was an issue in early reviews of the car and still stands today but design/layout was well received. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpg123 Posted December 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 Interesting debate - for the record, I am definitely NOT thinking of restoring a 986! God forbid! Mine is in fine fettle, what I was really wondering is, is or when is the point that it would ever become viable (like MGB's/big Healey's etc) to do this. There must be a point somewhere otherwise we'll end up with zero 986's left as they eventually wear out. Interestingly, there are currently more MBG's on UK roads than 986's (according to the How Many Left website). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gIzzE Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 I think that point is now happening. Even last year, the cost of sporting the suspension on one of these would have pretty much cost more than most cars were worth. That is now changing. As they get older, and people realise it could be their last chance to own one, the prices will increase. Combine that with a generation who grew up seeing these cars as kids with disposable income, which we are now getting to close to, and prices will suddenly start to climb fast. Last 986 Boxsters were 17 years ago? The 14 year old kid who used to like them, or like Porsche, will be in his 40s in 9 years time, probably have a house with a bit of drive space and something like a Boxtser will be his entry point into classic Porsche, it has happened like that withe every generation of pretty much every car out there. Can't see anything changing in regards to want. It may be that things change because of ICE etc. of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennym1984 Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 I'm not convinced that 986s are ever going to rocket up in value in the near future. There are a lot of them about and whilst they are fantastic cars, they're not really the Porsche that kids back in the 90s and 00s grew up dreaming about. Part of their current appeal is the fact that they are cheap and a low risk (in terms of price) route into Porsche ownership. Personally, I think that the current obsession with Porsche values is getting ridiculous (have a read of the "Cayman R" thread on pistonheads if you want to see a group of people more interested in resale than they are in driving) and it is preventing owners from enjoying them as they are supposed to be enjoyed. I'd love an old, hot-rodded 911 BUT not if it meant that I couldn't thrash it without constantly worrying about the financial implications...Until then I'll stick with my stone-chipped Cayman (and would happily buy another 986) This guy has the right idea... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gIzzE Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 Look at 996 prices though, they have started to climb quickly. That would have been the ideal entry point for someone into 'classic' Porsche, but in 5-10 years time they will be £30k starting price with many much higher. Will the 986 Boxster still be a £6k car then? Of course not. And that will be the point where restoring one will be worth doing financially. With the ban on new ICE car sales, these will become proper toys, that could of course push prices either way. Used prices staying high is a good thing, it means people don't have an issue paying for the upkeep needed. But I agree, drive them. I would prefer a car that has had a suspension rebuild, any engine weaknesses sorted with 100,000 miles on it than some original 30k mile car every time. Use the thing, they need to be used, garage queens are a complete pain to own. I used always buy low milage examples and they always ended up being the problem cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
map Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 27 minutes ago, Lennym1984 said: I'd love an old, hot-rodded 911 BUT not if it meant that I couldn't thrash it without constantly worrying about the fireball implications 🙃 CFA - A=Amusement Driving a Hot Rod 911 swiftly can quickly become brutally horrible - you really need to be on your game as the approach is in many ways counter intuitive to pretty much every other car and, in my experience, especially a 986. Had an interesting chat with a guy who has for years specialised in pre964 911s in terms of valuations, sourcing and the like - his view is that the 986's time is coming for well looked after cars. He also said, unprompted (especially interesting for me and I think a few others) that he really believes that HotRod 986s will become "a thing" - by this he means properly sorted non-OE modified cars. Think RGruppe style... that is modded for the owner's taste rather than a market place. OK there's no direct "in period" race heritage but there are plenty of cues to be adopted from Porsche motorsport, RUF, Singer and the like. This aligns with the "bespoke as luxury" play that's happening in all sorts of consumer areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubaregs Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 Back in the 80's Bike magazine costed all the parts to build a bike from scratch, iirc it was 3 or 4 times the cost of buying the bike brand new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennym1984 Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, map said: He also said, unprompted (especially interesting for me and I think a few others) that he really believes that HotRod 986s will become "a thing" - by this he means properly sorted non-OE modified cars. Think RGruppe style... that is modded for the owner's taste rather than a market place. OK there's no direct "in period" race heritage but there are plenty of cues to be adopted from Porsche motorsport, RUF, Singer and the like. This aligns with the "bespoke as luxury" play that's happening in all sorts of consumer areas. I definitely agree with this. If you look at the old outlaw Porsches they always started out as the "cheap" models which actual driving enthusiasts could get hold of - 356s (when they were just old), 964s etc. I'm all behind hot-rodding a 986 but this goes against everything that the value obsessed beards will look for in an investment piece. I think that the affordability of Boxsters is a good thing, not only because people can buy them to actually drive but also because they are cheap enough that one doesn't need to be worried about the financial implications of picking up a stone chip or fitting non-factory suspension. Even if prices rise 50 or even 100%, you are still talking relatively small amounts (even less so when you factor in general cost of living increases) and so the person who restores a Boxster in 10 years time is likely to be the same person restoring one today - an enthusiast doing it for his/her own pleasure rather than somebody buying an "investment piece." I think this is a good thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubdubz Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 I have a 1968 VW Westfalia - it was give or take $3000 new in 1968, that is equivalent to $22500 ish in todays money, so its held on to its own and is probably worth a bit more than that now. I have not lost as I bought it before they went up, in 2008. So I see rough and neglected cars sub 2k ones being recommissioned to be used by enthusiasts as opposed to garage trinkets my point is I might just see a shift in value - but it could be easily be 30 + years before the 987 I own gets into that status. Until then I intend to drive it when I can and maintain it to the best of my ability for my kids Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 On 12/16/2020 at 12:35 PM, ½cwt said: The quality and finish of the interior materials, particularly plastics, was an issue in early reviews of the car and still stands today but design/layout was well received. I must say, Ive not found that on my 986 at all, or are you speaking about the 987 knobs, I know these had a soft coating that comes off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulQ Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, the baron said: I must say, Ive not found that on my 986 at all Me neither. To be fair he did say it was an issue in early reviews..... maybe none of the cars had extended leather.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 According to the website "how many are left" there are only 865 cars made in the year 1997 on the road in the UK so that's pretty rare in my opinion. https://www.howmanyleft.co.uk/vehicle/porsche_boxster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulQ Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 Out of how many.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, PaulQ said: Out of how many.? Many thousands no doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the baron Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 4 hours ago, Lennym1984 said: I'm not convinced that 986s are ever going to rocket up in value in the near future. There are a lot of them about and whilst they are fantastic cars, they're not really the Porsche that kids back in the 90s and 00s grew up dreaming about. Part of their current appeal is the fact that they are cheap and a low risk (in terms of price) route into Porsche ownership. Personally, I think that the current obsession with Porsche values is getting ridiculous (have a read of the "Cayman R" thread on pistonheads if you want to see a group of people more interested in resale than they are in driving) and it is preventing owners from enjoying them as they are supposed to be enjoyed. I'd love an old, hot-rodded 911 BUT not if it meant that I couldn't thrash it without constantly worrying about the financial implications...Until then I'll stick with my stone-chipped Cayman (and would happily buy another 986) This guy has the right idea... Nice vid, thanks for posting, definitely a man after my own heart, right attitude, just get out and drive it, keep the faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
½cwt Posted December 18, 2020 Report Share Posted December 18, 2020 8 hours ago, the baron said: I must say, Ive not found that on my 986 at all, or are you speaking about the 987 knobs, I know these had a soft coating that comes off. The soft top finish surface damages very easily on my 2000 version compared to any other car I've owned, and the perception of the quality of the plastics in the interiors at launch for a vehicle at the price point is echoed from my recent reading of Paul Frere's book on the development and history of the Boxster, which intriguingly I believe you recommended in a thread I read but I may be mistaken, if so apologies if I am. Very good read though particularly as I don't normally go for model specific books as I find them a bit too detailed but in this case very relevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazbot Posted December 19, 2020 Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 23 hours ago, gIzzE said: Last 986 Boxsters were 17 years ago? I hope not otherwise my March 2004 986 is a ringer 😁 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlM Posted December 19, 2020 Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 48 minutes ago, Shazbot said: I hope not otherwise my March 2004 986 is a ringer 😁 Mine to😱 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
½cwt Posted December 19, 2020 Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Shazbot said: I hope not otherwise my March 2004 986 is a ringer 😁 OK, 16¾ years ago.... but that may have been built in 2003. The 987 came in for 2005 Model Year - model years typically starts in September/October of the previous year although with re-tooling for the 987 there may have been a small delay but no 986s would been built later than Aug 2004. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gIzzE Posted December 19, 2020 Report Share Posted December 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Shazbot said: I hope not otherwise my March 2004 986 is a ringer 😁 I was thinking we are now in 2021 almost, 2004 was 17 years ago. But yeah, maybe 16.5 years old. 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpg123 Posted December 20, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2020 For some reason I think my 2004 986 was a April/May build date. Does that make it hugely more valuable as it’s “one of the last built”?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menoporsche Posted December 20, 2020 Report Share Posted December 20, 2020 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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