Generator failure - Park Vehicle safely

[moonshine]

Last night, when out for a drive, i stopped the car to save a lamb (seriously! it was on the wrong side of a gate - so i stopped to get it into the field!) 

when i restarted the car i got a Generator (Alternator failure ) warning on the cluster. I managed to drive the 6 miles home, (turned off lights, A/C and stereo to reduce battery load) by which point the battery voltage was down to 12.1V, and the car was idling lumpily.

I Called Porsche Assist (as the car has a OPC warranty, and they offered to send out an AA chap to me last night, or a Porsche tech tomorrow - so as i have a daily driver, and the garage would have been closed anyway and the car was safely at home, Im  waiting the Porsche tech to come tomorrow lunchtime.

I took these pictures this evening (as evidence) i got this error, followed by the ASS disabled.

I then remembered the Victron Smartbattey sense i have fitted to monitor battery charge https://www.victronenergy.com/accessories/smart-battery-sense Also datalogs battery voltage - and one can review it - 

for nerd factor, you can see the point of Alternator failure, and the limp home, with failing battery charge

I went out around 1800h - battery voltage jumps from a rest voltage of 12.8V to a charging voltage of 14.9-15.0V and was working at 19.32h

It then fails and the voltage drops to 12.14V by the time I got home around 2000h

Then the battery recovered to a resting state of 12.6v over night with no load on it

it is still not charging today, so i expect a low loader tomorrow to take it to teh OPC, where hopefully tthe alternator will get changed FOC under the extended OPC Warranty

Victron stuff is great 👍

 

 

[Carmine]

Just remove the battery monitor lest they blame it for causing the problem in the first place! Crackers but it could happen. If the warranty is read with pedant’s specs the car has been modified.

[moonshine]

2 minutes ago, Carmine said:

Just remove the battery monitor lest they blame it for causing the problem in the first place! Crackers but it could happen. If the warranty is read with pedant’s specs the car has been modified.

Fair point, it is definitely not a cause, but not worth the aggro. It's only onto the battery shunt and grounded to the chassis.. It's essentially a BT voltmeter 

[JurassicBGTS]

8 hours ago, Carmine said:

Just remove the battery monitor lest they blame it for causing the problem in the first place! Crackers but it could happen. If the warranty is read with pedant’s specs the car has been modified.

I would be inclined to remove any hard wired accessory or mod also. I don't think you can give Porsche any scope to say fitting "this or that" could have caused an issue with the alternator. Given they even tell you the dimensions of a cigarette socket adapter that has to be used and state the wrong length of adapter may damage the electrical system😱

Hope all goes well today👍

[iborguk]

@moonshine How’d you get on ?

[moonshine]

8 minutes ago, iborguk said:

@moonshine How’d you get on ?

Tech confirmed the alternator was fubar'd / charging issue - Collected this morning on lowloader.

It's at the OPC who have confirmed the OPC warranty is in effect and it should be covered, I've also raised the missing hand on the Sports Chrono, and that is hopefully covered by OPC warranty too.🤞

[cozzykim]

I had this happen Southbound on the M5 in a SAAB 9-3, on the way to a customer in Gloucester. The first sign was that the power steering became intermittent in some contraflow roadworks. I turned off my headlights, radio, heater blower etc, and managed to carry on the last five miles or so to the A38 exit and then up into Gloucester.

As I arrived in their car park the gearbox stuck in 1st gear and the engine stopped. While I was working they charged the battery for me and I drove the car home to the High Peak in daylight with no more problems.

Then, about a fortnight later, despite having been fine since the previous episode, the same thing happened on my way back from a customer in Huddersfield. I'd stopped in a car park above Glossop to admire the scenery and drink a can of orange and dropped the top, which then refused to go back up when I tried to leave. This time I had a USB charger with a voltage readout in the car, still showing 12V with no extra loads on the battery.

By the time I got home it was down to 8.9V. 

A new alternator sorted it.

[moonshine]

Hmm.

OPC not playing ball.

They say 

Belt has come off due to tensioner bolt snapping. Requires new tensioner (w) and drive belt with roller, not warranty, price

£707.72

Not covered by warranty 😡

T&C

 

Edited April 28, 2023 by moonshine

[EXY]

Oh crapola 

I remember having to replace the tensioner/roller on my CVH XR2,  IIRC that was £15 and I fitted it myself.

[Scubaregs]

How can a snapped bolt be wear and tear, it's not a serviceable item?

[Carmine]

wowza - I would push back on that conclusion politely but firmly. the policy doesn’t have a blanket exclusion on the tensioner - it excludes the tensioner if it fails due to wear and tear. a snapped bolt is not wear and tear - it’s a failed part. end of story.

a tensioner spring that weakens with time or a tensioner bearing that gets noisy - that’s wear and tear. 

[Bike Loon]

^^ What he said. Bolts are not meant to snap and it is not a wear and tear item. They are trying to f*ck you over

[moonshine]

That's what I said. It's a mechanical failure, not wear and tear.

The service manager said they need to code the failure into the Porcshe system and the code for the deflection pully and  the bolt both start with the same p/n and the P/n is excluded on the porsche system. 

[iborguk]

Check my thinking 

Bolt is PAF 008 361

Tensioner is 0PB 903 317

[iborguk]

https://www.eurospares.co.uk/Parts/0PB903317/Porsche/New/117328

 

[Araf]

The 987.2 tensioner and belt (I assume you meant this rather than bolt) have similar part numbers (9A110221100 and9A110221601).  If the belt shows signs of wear, it's a fair cop.  If the belt is in good condition apart from a cut across it, you can expect the tensioner to have let go first.

Your car is obviously a few years old, when was the belt last inpected and changed?

 

[Paul P]

19 minutes ago, Carmine said:

wowza - I would push back on that conclusion politely but firmly. the policy doesn’t have a blanket exclusion on the tensioner - it excludes the tensioner if it fails due to wear and tear. a snapped bolt is not wear and tear - it’s a failed part. end of story.

a tensioner spring that weakens with time or a tensioner bearing that gets noisy - that’s wear and tear. 

^^ this ^^ - I hadn't noticed the "wear and tear" wording - I assumed it was a blanket "not covered" 

[moonshine]

https://www.eurospares.co.uk/Porsche/Boxster_981/Boxster_981_(2013)/PartDiagrams/101-010/BELT TENSIONER

 

[moonshine]

16 minutes ago, Araf said:

The 987.2 tensioner and belt (I assume you meant this rather than bolt) have similar part numbers (9A110221100 and9A110221601).

 

Nope - the BOLT has sheared

[Scubaregs]

Glasgow OPC?

No way would I be accepting that under "wear and tear".

[moonshine]

1 minute ago, Scubaregs said:

Glasgow OPC?

No way would I be accepting that under "wear and tear".

Yes 

[iborguk]

45 minutes ago, moonshine said:

https://www.eurospares.co.uk/Porsche/Boxster_981/Boxster_981_(2013)/PartDiagrams/101-010/BELT TENSIONER

 

Check with an OPC parts dept, I think the ones I quoted are the superseding part numbers

Bolt/Torx Screw is PAF 008 361 (replaces 999 073 412 01) , £2.65 inc. VAT

Tensioner is 0PB 903 317 (replaces 948 102 261 00), £114.52 inc. VAT

 

Edited April 28, 2023 by iborguk

[½cwt]

So if the tensioner mechanism and the roller bearing are still in good order, i.e. would work correctly if refitted with a new bolt, the tensioner has not failed.  The bolt has clearly failed leaving them hanging lose and probably damaging the belt.  That is quite clearly a material failure of a bolt and it a a clean sudden failure as there is no apparent 'beach mark' showing a crack working its way through the bolt and then fatigue failure (ask a metallurgist for a proper description of the failure mode from looking at the exposed crystals of the metal, as my engineering materials science is a bit rusty), therefore is not on the exclusion list.  Ask them whether a cylinder head stud would be covered if it snapped, or even a suspension bolt.  If they still have a real problem and maintain it is wear and tear ask them for the factory service schedule that show where it is inspected and replaced in the service schedule...  If it is not in there it is a failure, if it is and you are under the mileage/years then it is still an early life failure.

12 minutes ago, iborguk said:

Check with an OPC parts dept, I think the ones I quoted are the superseding part numbers

Bolt/Torx Screw is PAF 008 361 , £2.65

Tensioner is 0PB 903 317 , £114.52

 

I've got these from the Porsche downloadable PET pdf files for a 981 drawing 101-010...

9 - 999 073 411 01 Hexagon socket flat head bolt M8 X 60

2 - 9A2 102 211 00 Tensioning roller (also use 9A1 102 212 00 - see below -, 999 073 579 01, 948 102 839 00)

19 - 9A1 102 212 00 Tensioning roller

[moonshine]

The problem is if the OPC stick to their initial position, there is little wiggle room 

[iborguk]

5 minutes ago, moonshine said:

The problem is if the OPC stick to their initial position, there is little wiggle room 

Maybe start with they aren't the same part/part number (bolt vs tensioner) ? Assuming you've not already been down that road.